The 2-Minute Drill

[Mobtown]

I haven't seen anyone else really dig into this...

It really burns me that each and every year we seem to find some new way to look like morons in the last two minutes.

Billick would have you believe that last nights embarassing waste of 3 points was the fault of the officials. I disagree. The poorly executed drill falls squarely on the shoulders of the coaching staff and Steve McNair.

1. Steve should know better. He is a vet and he should have spiked the ball on 3rd down. Also, I know it's pre-season, but you better have a damn good reason for calling time outs so early in the game.

2. WTF is our coaching staff thinking? A between the tackles run on 3rd down with only 16 seconds on the clock? Disgusting. Hearing Billick blame the officials disgusts me. It is insulting to Ravens fans who have watched the drill be mis-managed time and time again.

Coach: Don't put your team in the position of having a drive decided by the clock OR the officials. This is coaching 101 and you should be ashamed.

I am going to be watching Billick and Co. closely this year to see if they have made any effort to improve their decision making. The first time that they cost us a game because of BS like we saw last night, I will be calling for their collective heads.

[Losac]

I agree Mob. I was surprised to hear him try to blame the officials too. It was piss-poor clock management. They stood around for a good 15 seconds as if they had no idea what the play was before that stupid running play on 3rd down.

[FellsPointRaven]

Same as the end of the half last week. Our clock management continues to suck. The calling of a run down the middle defied belief, to the point where I was sitting there thinking I'd missed something. Listening to the radio on the way home from the game, they said they 'wanted to try it'? Why? Surely ANY right thinking person throws the ball in that situation, either into the endzone or a quick pass out to the sidelines to gain a few more yards for the FG unit.

Even though I am a big Billick supporter, the one constant of his reign has been abysmal play calling and clock management during the final two minutes of a half. It would seem that he simply panics and the nervousness of the crowd is tangible anytime we get the ball back with 60 yards and a buck 40 to go.

The one benefit I can think of from last night is that play will teach them that a) it sucks and b) you can't trust the officials to be timely and efficient when time is expiring. I would hope we learn from that and don't do it again.

[Mobtown]

The one benefit I can think of from last night is that play will teach them that a) it sucks and b) you can't trust the officials to be timely and efficient when time is expiring. I would hope we learn from that and don't do it again.

Isn't that the crux of the problem though? They keep making mistakes and we keep thinking they will learn from them.

An NFL caliber HC should NEVER give the officials the opportunity to decide a game.

[FellsPointRaven]

Isn't that the crux of the problem though? They keep making mistakes and we keep thinking they will learn from them.

I said hope, Mobtown, I don't think they will.

I agree with your sentiments entirely.

[Bez513]

Calling a running play on 3rd down was a very bad call. But the refs also wasted about 10 seconds exchanging the game ball with the kicking one.

[Mista T]

Same ol' Billick piss-poor coaching two-minute panic. The only worse two-minute coaching in the NFL was Mike Holmgren's SB 40 fiasco. I believe that Billick panics, losing his cool and therefore control. How many times have we seen the gun go off with unused TOs on the board? :confused:

[GreenWave52]

Same ol' Billick piss-poor coaching two-minute panic. The only worse two-minute coaching in the NFL was Mike Holmgren's SB 40 fiasco. I believe that Billick panics, losing his cool and therefore control. How many times have we seen the gun go off with unused TOs on the board? :confused:
As bad as that was it doesn't top the weekly exploits of Herm Edwards and crew. That coaching staff was brutal in NY and I suspect will be shaky in KC as well.

[Losac]

As bad as that was it doesn't top the weekly exploits of Herm Edwards and crew. That coaching staff was brutal in NY and I suspect will be shaky in KC as well.
Agreed. I remember the last road game we won was at the Meadowlands and Herm's poor clock management inside 2 minutes was blamed by all the Jets fans.

[Irishraven]

Agreed. I remember the last road game we won was at the Meadowlands and Herm's poor clock management inside 2 minutes was blamed by all the Jets fans.

That was some come back though! The interception by Ed Reed won us that game or the piss poor throw by the running back to the end zone!!!

Was that the last time Moore scored?

[Losac]

That was some come back though! The interception by Ed Reed won us that game or the piss poor throw by the running back to the end zone!!!

Was that the last time Moore scored?
Yeah, the Reed interception was the turning point in that game. I think we were getting our asses kicked up to that point. And I think Moore had not 1, but 2 touchdowns from Boller.

[PurpleRulz]

In Billick's defense, he was responding to a question that was asked by the Rave TV Announcers. He kind of did not understand their question at first, but said, well it is preseason for the refs. Billick did follow that with, "but we made our share of mistakes."

Second, if Jim Fassel is "running the offense," shouldn't he get some scrutiny? Our offense just seemed lost at the end of that first half as if they did not know what they were doing. Hopefully, the 2 minute drill is the first thing we work on when we get back to "the Palace."

[highwater]

Calling a running play on 3rd down was a very bad call. But the refs also wasted about 10 seconds exchanging the game ball with the kicking one.

I agree with the both of the above points. I'm not defending our historically bad clock management, but the refs screwed up on that one. Even Stover was pissed.

[StingerNLG]

Were there timeouts left T? If there was, why didn't Matt Stover call it if he thought the ball was taking too long to spot? Couldn't he look up and see the clock ticking down? That is as much on Stover as anyone else.


Second, if Jim Fassel is "running the offense," shouldn't he get some scrutiny? Our offense just seemed lost at the end of that first half as if they did not know what they were doing. Hopefully, the 2 minute drill is the first thing we work on when we get back to "the Palace."

Absolutely. Running Musa Smith up the middle during a 2 minute drill? And where was McNair to throw out and to the sidelines during all this? The whole team needs to work on that before next week.

[Losac]

No Stinger, there were no timeouts left. They ran a running play right up the middle on 3rd down with 16 seconds left, and then tried to rush the field goal team in immediately after. It was stupid. The running play was essentially a waste. Either have McNair spike it, or a quick throw to the sidelines or a shot at the endzone.

The officials were too slow in spotting the ball, but that should be a non-issue. Whoever called that running play on 3rd down, Billick or Fassel, should be horse-whipped.

[Mobtown]

Second, if Jim Fassel is "running the offense," shouldn't he get some scrutiny?

Yes, definately. I tried not to lay it at Billick's feet, but instead used terms like "coaching staff".

Yes, the officials screwed up but...

Isn't blaming the officials sort of like being mad because you lost to a last second field goal? If your team had played well enough to keep the game from being that close, then you wouldn't be faced with a last second loss.

Had the coashing staff not tried to get all fancy and just spiked the ball or had taken a shot at the end zone, then the officials would not have become a factor.

Blaming the officials is just a poor attempt at distracting us from the real problem, shitty 2-minute dicision making.

[Mobtown]

No Stinger, there were no timeouts left. They ran a running play right up the middle on 3rd down with 16 seconds left, and then tried to rush the field goal team in immediately after. It was stupid. The running play was essentially a waste. Either have McNair spike it, or a quick throw to the sidelines or a shot at the endzone.

The officials were too slow in spotting the ball, but that should be a non-issue. Whoever called that running play on 3rd down, Billick or Fassel, should be horse-whipped.


exactly, you beat me to it.

[Losac]

Billick seems completely unapologetic about it though. His attitude is "We practiced this. We had plenty of time. The officials screwed up", and that scares me. I know Billick is stubborn, but at least admit you're wrong and change your ways once in awhile.

[Mobtown]

Billick seems completely unapologetic about it though.

I think this is what pisses me off the most. Had this been a one time deal, or if our 2-minute hadn't sucked since forever then I could go along with the "officials screwed us" argument, but we have seen this from Billick and his crew sooo many times that it has become predictable.

[StingerNLG]

No Stinger, there were no timeouts left.

Ok, thanks for clearing up. I couldn't remember because they had called a TO well earlier and I lost count.

[Bez513]

Ok, thanks for clearing up. I couldn't remember because they had called a TO well earlier and I lost count.

And don't forget the lost a TO because they lost the challenege to McNair's fumble. It was close but it was clear to me his arm was not going forward. So the waste of the challenge also screwed us at the half.

[Greg]

And don't forget the lost a TO because they lost the challenege to McNair's fumble. It was close but it was clear to me his arm was not going forward. So the waste of the challenge also screwed us at the half.
Not to mention the TO we called when McNair slid at the 25. They spotted it at the 27 which at first I thought was good, but then on the replay you could see he should have been spotted at the 25, that is where the ball landed when he slid.

So they call TO. They could have challenged and stopped the clock, gained 2 yards and not used a time out. Worst thing that could happen is you lose the challenge and a time out and end up right where you were. Okay, it costs you a challenge, but the chance to save the time out and make the 3rd down 1 yard to go instead of 3 was worth it.

The only play besides a spike for the FG on that last play is a shot to the end zone. We were well within Stover range so a sideline pass for a few yards is an unnecessary gamble. A running play, even if it gets you the first down, accomplishes what? 2 or even 10 more yards? If he gets the TD, a very small chance on the compacted field, that is the only possible benefit. It is more likely he breaks it off for 8-10 yards and the time run off during that and setting up for the spike probably ends the half as well. Horrid, inexcusable call.

The challenge on McNair's fumble was incredible foolish, his arm never even went forward and was still being cocked when he lost the ball.

[Brandon]

Our two minute drill sucks, period! Nuff said.

I mentioned this in the game thread, that when I was at training camp practice, the two minute drill looked like crap when they practiced it. And well, it is showing on the field as well.

[Ravens0587]

I think the run was supposed to get the ball away from the far hash.

And they do practive it all the time. running the kicking team on the field.

for those of you that saw it stover was pissed at the refs for switching the balls.

Had they not switched the balls, they would have had enough time if the refs set the ball in time.

the zebras f'ed up bad

[Greg]

I don't care that the refs F'd up, we were on the 17. What is the point of the run. Either kill the clock with a spike or throw it into the end zone. The only thing positive that the running play could give beyond a FG try would be a TD. What are the odds of running one in from 17 yards out? And if Musa gets close but doesn't quite get in there wouldn't have been time to spike the ball after the run. IT MAKES NO SENSE, NONE!

[Ravenatic20]

I don't care that the refs F'd up, we were on the 17. What is the point of the run. Either kill the clock with a spike or throw it into the end zone. The only thing positive that the running play could give beyond a FG try would be a TD. What are the odds of running one in from 17 yards out? And if Musa gets close but doesn't quite get in there wouldn't have been time to spike the ball after the run. IT MAKES NO SENSE, NONE!
I agree. A pop up to Heap in the end zone, or just a simple spike would have made the most sense to me.

[crowdog89]

Not to mention the TO we called when McNair slid at the 25. They spotted it at the 27 which at first I thought was good, but then on the replay you could see he should have been spotted at the 25, that is where the ball landed when he slid.

Greg, I believe that when a qb slides, it's not where the ball lands, but where the slide begins where the ball is marked. That's my understanding of the rule anyway.

[Greg]

Greg, I believe that when a qb slides, it's not where the ball lands, but where the slide begins where the ball is marked. That's my understanding of the rule anyway.
Correct, but when he slid the ball landed on the 25, at least that is what it looked like on the big boards. In any case, why not challenge, the worst that could have happened was...WE LOSE THE SAME TO WE USED!

Now I only saw one replay at the game and you know how good those are, but that's the way it appeared.

[DeepPurple]

I would like Billick or Fassel to answer, even if we had made the two yards and a first down, what was the upside? Anything short of the endzone wasn't going to cut it, this isn't college where they stop the clock on a first down.

There was only three choices that could of been made; 1) bring out the field goal unit and kick on third down while the clock was running 2) spike the ball on third down and bring out the field goal unit on fourth down while the clock was stopped 3) pass to the endzone on third down and if not successful kick field goal on fourth down. The option of running up the middle on third down with no timeouts and the clock running with 16 seconds shouldn't of even entered the equation.

[Ravens0587]

I think the clock doesn't stop on first downs in college anymore

[Hrafn]

No doubt our two minute drill sucks, but I am willing to let this one slide on account that it is the preseason.

The fact that both Billick and Stover in a sideline interview during the 3rd quarter both blamed it on the refs, changing the ball instead of spotting the ball used on 3rd down as they are supposed to. According to Stover they call it a Bingo play and are supposed to execute in 18 seconds. That they have a name for it indicates that it is something that they practise and have there for a reason.

Let me give you an example. We're down by 3, 30 seconds to go in the 4th. 3rd down and a bit to go at at the 30-somthing yard line and are out of time outs. We need to get a little closer or get it to the right hash mark to give Matt a better chance. This is the drill we need to have down and pratice in a live situation. Think regular season game or even playoff. Would be sad if we hadn't practised it in the preseason.

Another reason that make me believe that this is what they wanted to do was that there was about 15 seconds from the completion to Clayton until the snap on 3rd down. They were slow all the way from the completion to Heap.

If we wanted to practise two minute drill that ends in TD, no doubt they would have gone no huddle from the completion to Heap, or at least call a few plays at a time. But they sure took their time to get plays underway.

I would rather we practised a TD endning two minute drill, but they better also have the Bingo play down when we need it to tie a game up or win it in the waning seconds of an important game. So I'm ok with it.

[Greg]

There was only three choices that could of been made; 1) bring out the field goal unit and kick on third down while the clock was running 2) spike the ball on third down and bring out the field goal unit on fourth down while the clock was stopped 3) pass to the endzone on third down and if not successful kick field goal on fourth down. The option of running up the middle on third down with no timeouts and the clock running with 16 seconds shouldn't of even entered the equation.
Exactly, thanks for clearly saying what I was trying to say.

Those were the only 3 reasonable options.

Hrafn, if they were practicing a drill for running a play to get closer and even position the ball then get out for the kick that would be fine with me. And in that case they should just say "we normally wouldn't do that at the 17, but we wanted to practice for that in case we had a game situation where we wanted a few more yards" then I would buy it.

I think they wanted to keep going for the TD, something more important to practice, and mistakenly called that running play. And worse yet, THEY MAY NOT SEE IT AS A MISTAKE!

Fine, run another play, BUT PASS, you have little to no shot at a TD from there on the ground anyway. And a failed pass stops the clock.

[Hrafn]

Surely it was a moronic play call if they didn't want to go through what I outlined. But I refuse to believe that Fassel is that dumb. Many a regular season two minute drill begs to differ, but in this instance I cannot believe that they would mess it up so badly with nothing on the line.

[DeepPurple]

In high school or college and with a less experienced kicker I could see the hash marks might be a consideration. However, in the NFL the hash marks are only 7 yards apart, so the ball is spotted no more than 3-1/2 yards from center of the field at anytime and we've got a kicker who's been kicking in the NFL since 1989. If you need more yards to get in field goal range and have no timeouts, you throw to the sidelines. Plus the excuse of the referees having to change footballs shouldn't be an excuse, they've been using special kicking balls for at least five years.

In reference to the poster about college no longer stopping the clock on a first down, it was still in use last season, so if it's been changed that's a brand new rule change. I watch as much college football as I do pro, which is a lot.

[Ravens0587]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/preview06/news/story?id=2543105


3. Game clock (Rule 3-2-5, 3-2-5-e)

Change: When the ball is free kicked, the game clock will start. When Team B is awarded a first down, the game clock will start on the ready-for-play signal.

Rationale: One of the goals in revising the rules was to shorten the length of games. The game clock will now start when the ball hits the kicker's foot on free kicks and kickoffs, and when the referee signals the ball is ready for play on first downs, instead of at the snap. Many coaches believe these changes will eliminate 10-15 plays per game.

[Hrafn]

In high school or college and with a less experienced kicker I could see the hash marks might be a consideration. However, in the NFL the hash marks are only 7 yards apart, so the ball is spotted no more than 3-1/2 yards from center of the field at anytime and we've got a kicker who's been kicking in the NFL since 1989. If you need more yards to get in field goal range and have no timeouts, you throw to the sidelines. Plus the excuse of the referees having to change footballs shouldn't be an excuse, they've been using special kicking balls for at least five years.


I'd say throwing to the sidelines is a more high risk play than a run play. Risk of sack, incompletion, fumble and int, vs risk of fumble and loss of yards on run play.

Check Billick's PC on br.com or Aarons article.

I don't know if Billick's PC was just spin, but he said the officials were apologetic about it. Making me think that special kicking balls are not used in similar situations. The ball used on pevious down will be used.

No further on this on my part.


However Billick also stated that they also ran on the Boller led 2 minute drill vs Gmen. That getting a 1st down + spike gives you a more controlled opportunity to try for the end zone with 10 seconds or so on the clock.

I don't see how this is the case. With 30 seconds on the clock and third down as the scenario pass play to no later than end zone at 10 seconds remaining:

Do you risk not getting the first down, and letting the other team know it is an end zone pass to gain 20 seconds of getting the play in? Here is where I no longer support the thinking of the coaching staff. Bingo play (here used as run + field goal) only applicable if long FG situation and a couple of yards gives you higher conversion rate.

[Mobtown]

Hrafn, if they were practicing a drill for running a play to get closer and even position the ball then get out for the kick that would be fine with me. And in that case they should just say "we normally wouldn't do that at the 17, but we wanted to practice for that in case we had a game situation where we wanted a few more yards" then I would buy it.


/agree

IF this was a designed play then I would go with the coaches contention that the refs screwed us.

but...

I still don't see a ligit reason for designing a play around this scenario. Unless we are just outside FG range and the coaches want to try to pick up an additional 10yrds or so, there is no reason NOT to simply spike the ball on third down. Even is they do need some more yards, a between the tackles run is just about the worst way to go about it.

The other factor to consider is that, designed or not, our 2-minute offese has been abismal the past few years. Why practice such an unlikely scenario when you can't even get the basic 2-minute drill down?