Cam Cameron (10 years)

[RavensNTerps]

epic fail by harbaugh and cam, you think NE gives a shit who they play to make that team dictate what the hell they wanna do? this is difference bewteen great coaches and good coaches. Great coaches make teams adjust to what they are doing and if they do then they make their adjustments and counter. If you already go into a game thinking about how teams are going to dictate what your doing then you already lost 3/4 of the battle.

No it isn't. Joe Flacco showed that he's not ready to run that type of offense. He completely utterly shat the bed trying in KC and Houston. Why should we put the offense in a position to fail by speeding it up when even the staunchest defenders of Joe Flacco have to admit one thing he is not is a quick decision maker.

[RavensNTerps]

Cam didn't run the offense in SD. It was Marty's offense, the same one he ran in Cleveland.

Shottenheimer was very conventional. Run Run Pass Punt. Cam seems to go out of his way to do the exact opposite of what a normal play caller would do.

That's simply not true. Take for instance the game on Sunday against Pittsburgh. The Steelers literally DARED us to air the ball out deep all game. They squatted at the line, bringing #43 up on every down he was in and played 1 deep safety with off-man on the outside with 2 back up CBs. The game plan that we utilized was the absolute 100% correct game plan and it didn't succeed because we didn't execute. That's on Flacco, Torrey, Jacoby, and Anquan but mainly on Flacco.

[RavensNTerps]

I could be wrong but it seems as if your point is that Cam Cameron, over the years, and even with mad talent at his disposal, has basically put up average numbers as an offensive coordinator. And that given the talent at his disposal, the net result is that he, in reality, is a below average offensive coordinator. (I'm not trying to put words into your mouth; that's just my take on what you've posted.)

I didn't realize that being ranked 10th in total yards and 3rd, 1st, and 5th in points scored was grounds for being called "mediocre" on offense.

[s.r.genovese]

No it isn't. Joe Flacco showed that he's not ready to run that type of offense. He completely utterly shat the bed trying in KC and Houston. Why should we put the offense in a position to fail by speeding it up when even the staunchest defenders of Joe Flacco have to admit one thing he is not is a quick decision maker.

People do forget this pretty quickly. It looked terrible in those games. People have it in their mind that No Huddle=Points but that's really hasn't been the case.

It also wore the hell out of the defense.

[RavensNTerps]

Ding good teams impose their will. It's just ridiculous that the no huddle was unstoppable at times and they just stop using it.


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We should NEVER be running the no huddle anymore as far as I'm concerned. Ever.

[RavensNTerps]

I agree the number attempts are not the issue in the way the 49ers are "safe" with Alex Smith. But I think the pass routes and pass plays are "safe" in the sense they don't require too much decision-making and they avoid the areas of the field where a mis-read can easily turn into an INT.

So to me, even if we threw every down, the design and risk-averseness and simplicity of the pass plays themselves could hold back a QB who otherwise would thrive (assuming the QB could handle the extra risk and responisibilty without making so many mistakes as to lead to worse results).

So I agree, Cam would need to change everything if he wants a pass-happy offense (which he seems to be okay with). Using a Martyball playbook but throwing it more times than running it isn't the solution.

The thing that people don't get, for whatever reason, is that the reason the offense seems to have regressed is because it HAS been opened up more and the reason Flacco had more success early was because it was scaled back/dumbed down.

Flacco looked like he was ready to take the next step when it wasn't an offense designed around him. He had the arm, he could make any throw, and he was able to come through WHEN CALLED UPON. Then in year 3 or so they opened it up for him to come through at ALL TIMES and he's pretty much by and large fallen well short of expectations.

And honestly, please don't bring up last year's playoffs as a defense. He was awful against Houston (we scored twice on offense, both on drives starting in the red zone) and he was very good against a New England defense that everyone was very good against.

[Jsmoove]

That's simply not true. Take for instance the game on Sunday against Pittsburgh. The Steelers literally DARED us to air the ball out deep all game. They squatted at the line, bringing #43 up on every down he was in and played 1 deep safety with off-man on the outside with 2 back up CBs. The game plan that we utilized was the absolute 100% correct game plan and it didn't succeed because we didn't execute. That's on Flacco, Torrey, Jacoby, and Anquan but mainly on Flacco.

you kidding me right? They dared us to throw the deep ball? NO they did exactly what other teams been doing since october and september, they took away smith with the over and under coverage blankted the sidelines from 10-15 and they spied rice the whole game. You did get 1/3rd of that right, where they dared us to throw the deep ball is in the middle of the field with one safety in cover 1. But your dude Cam call any plays to the middle of the field? did he flood the zones with multiple WR sets? did he spread them out to take advantage of that one safety cover? fuck no! try again dude.

[RavensQB]

you kidding me right? They dared us to throw the deep ball? NO they did exactly what other teams been doing since october and september, they took away smith with the over and under coverage blankted the sidelines from 10-15 and they spied rice the whole game. You did get 1/3rd of that right, where they dared us to throw the deep ball is in the middle of the field with one safety in cover 1. But your dude Cam call any plays to the middle of the field? did he flood the zones with multiple WR sets? did he spread them out to take advantage of that one safety cover? fuck no! try again dude.

Why even try? Dude just does not get it.

[RavensNTerps]

you kidding me right? They dared us to throw the deep ball? NO they did exactly what other teams been doing since october and september, they took away smith with the over and under coverage blankted the sidelines from 10-15 and they spied rice the whole game. You did get 1/3rd of that right, where they dared us to throw the deep ball is in the middle of the field with one safety in cover 1. But your dude Cam call any plays to the middle of the field? did he flood the zones with multiple WR sets? did he spread them out to take advantage of that one safety cover? fuck no! try again dude.

Yes. They dared us to throw the deep ball. They stuck their back up corners in man coverage against Torrey Smith showing absolutely no respect for either Flacco or Smith. There WAS no over/under coverage most of the game. That's the point. 43 was up at the line all game shadowing 27. The corners were on an island. Back up corners. If anything, the middle was completely clogged up. The game plan was fine. Don't believe me? Check out film study's blog on this very board. He supports everything I claim.

[Paintballguy]

We should NEVER be running the no huddle anymore as far as I'm concerned. Ever.

I disagree. They struggled on the road, but they have to work through it. Flacco is still the 3rd highest rated QB at home with a 100.7 QB rating, and he's averaging 300 yards a game at home. He's been bipolar on the road though as we all know, as he's ranked among the bottom. The offensive line has also given up 7 more sacks on the road then at home.

[RavensQB]

Yes. They dared us to throw the deep ball. They stuck their back up corners in man coverage against Torrey Smith showing absolutely no respect for either Flacco or Smith. There WAS no over/under coverage most of the game. That's the point. 43 was up at the line all game shadowing 27. The corners were on an island. Back up corners. If anything, the middle was completely clogged up. The game plan was fine. Don't believe me? Check out film study's blog on this very board. He supports everything I claim.

Umm, ok, So who was left to clog the middle?!?

[Jsmoove]

The thing that people don't get, for whatever reason, is that the reason the offense seems to have regressed is because it HAS been opened up more and the reason Flacco had more success early was because it was scaled back/dumbed down.

Flacco looked like he was ready to take the next step when it wasn't an offense designed around him. He had the arm, he could make any throw, and he was able to come through WHEN CALLED UPON. Then in year 3 or so they opened it up for him to come through at ALL TIMES and he's pretty much by and large fallen well short of expectations.

And honestly, please don't bring up last year's playoffs as a defense. He was awful against Houston (we scored twice on offense, both on drives starting in the red zone) and he was very good against a New England defense that everyone was very good against.

If, I'm sitting here watching the game and I call damn near 70% of the plays the Ravens run on offense before they even run it, you know damn well the opposing team knows exactly what they are going to run 97%, teams know what we are going to run they sit on the routes, last 2 seasons it was zone coverage now this season is man coverage, the scheme has flaws, a good scheme beats any coverage. Schemes begin with coaches not players, as coach you put you players in situations to succeed, if 31-32 teams know what your are going to thats not putting your players in a situation to succeed now is it?

[Haloti92]

The thing that people don't get, for whatever reason, is that the reason the offense seems to have regressed is because it HAS been opened up more and the reason Flacco had more success early was because it was scaled back/dumbed down.

Flacco looked like he was ready to take the next step when it wasn't an offense designed around him. He had the arm, he could make any throw, and he was able to come through WHEN CALLED UPON. Then in year 3 or so they opened it up for him to come through at ALL TIMES and he's pretty much by and large fallen well short of expectations.

And honestly, please don't bring up last year's playoffs as a defense. He was awful against Houston (we scored twice on offense, both on drives starting in the red zone) and he was very good against a New England defense that everyone was very good against.

We opened it up some, and we certainly throw more, and he has been given more latitude in terms of simple audibles, but I still think we run less variable, more predictable plays. Plays that are designed to avoid risks (the middle of the field), quick-decisions (check-with-me hot reads based on pre-snap looks), and complicated progressions (flooding zones, double-moves, bunched formation rubs, etc vs. bombs and outs).

I am not arguing that Joe is blameless, quite the contrary, but I think that Cam's offense has issues in a 2012-style NFL, at least his offense here that is designed with Joe as the QB. I think it avoids the chances of turnover-fest games, but at the expense of total potential production. And like I said, depending on the quality of your QB, that trade-off may indeed increase your chances of winning; it also may not.

[Jsmoove]

Yes. They dared us to throw the deep ball. They stuck their back up corners in man coverage against Torrey Smith showing absolutely no respect for either Flacco or Smith. There WAS no over/under coverage most of the game. That's the point. 43 was up at the line all game shadowing 27. The corners were on an island. Back up corners. If anything, the middle was completely clogged up. The game plan was fine. Don't believe me? Check out film study's blog on this very board. He supports everything I claim.

Wrong they had the corner trail Torrey under while the safety shading the middle had the over coverage, they know jocaboy only runs intermediate routes so they leave all the underneath stuff to the nickel defender and LBs, everyone in this world knows pittsburgh is soft up the middle, thise seam routes are open all day, Ravens had one pass to pitta up the middle and it was money, after that is went away. They blanketed boldin in those pathetic curl routes by the backer and zone the corners on the hashes.. try again dude.

[RavensNTerps]

Wrong they had the corner trail Torrey under while the safety shading the middle had the over coverage, they know jocaboy only runs intermediate routes so they leave all the underneath stuff to the nickel defender and LBs, everyone in this world knows pittsburgh is soft up the middle, thise seam routes are open all day, Ravens had one pass to pitta up the middle and it was money, after that is went away. They blanketed boldin in those pathetic curl routes by the backer and zone the corners on the hashes.. try again dude.

lol you try again, dude. we also had several "money" passes on the outside as boldin breezed past #31 repeatedly. The steelers game plan was 1. take away ray rice 2. if you get beat, get beat on the outside.

[Jsmoove]

lol you try again, dude. we also had several "money" passes on the outside as boldin breezed past #31 repeatedly. The steelers game plan was 1. take away ray rice 2. if you get beat, get beat on the outside.

they did not take away Rice he broke one FOR A TD remember that? they took away rice as flacco's dump off. they played the deep ball day, by shading the outside hashes, I won't defend flacco because he looke liked shit as well, but there is reason why he hold on to the ball that long because theres no one open! the steelers played not to get beat deep and Cam played right into their hands, like he's done pretty much all season long with most teams we have played. If the players didn't execute then explain why Rice or Pierce didn't see one hand off in the 4th qtr?

[landspeed]

So I guess a good QB and a Hall of Fame RB and a great TE is no talent. This thread is not about Flacco, it's about Cam being mediocre so unless you can show some kind of legit reason that Cam is above average or even average than your missing the point.

Is this Cam's son? You little Ginger, go back to school...
Damn you got me, get off your Iphone and pay attention.

Not to mention Vincent Jackson didnt take off until 2008 - coincidentally the year cam left.

[seraph]

Not to mention Vincent Jackson didnt take off until 2008 - coincidentally the year cam left.

And you realized Cam drafted him in 2005 right?

Also what has AJ Smith done in San Diego after Wade and Cam left? Maybe there's a reason why Cam is having trouble implementing his ideas within the Ravens offense since apparently Ozzie and Harbaugh run the team.

[wickedsolo]

This thread is chock full of troll.

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[Sua Sponte]

So throwing the ball deep on ever 2nd and short and then coming back with some shit the bed hitch route is a good game plan against a Defense that is playing from the hashes out. It really is quite simple for a DB to only have to worry about covering from the hashes out. Also a deep ball stragey is not planning a successful game plan with nothing over the middle.