Draft / FA / Offseason Roster Moves (Merged)

**BigPlayReceiver** · 02-06-2013, 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mizerooskie

Hopkins runs better routes, has batter hands, and a larger catching radius than all of those guys.

He's a stud.

Hacked by DeAndre Hopkins!

Routes => Studman, Wheaton
Hands => Studman, Hopkins
Radius => Allen, Patterson, Hopkins

**alien bird** · 02-06-2013, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

We also have AT LEAST 3 more picks then roster spots available. No need to keep 11 picks, and IMO no need to keep Dickson.

Cutting Dickson would mean drafting another TE. Fine, but that's one of your 11 picks gone in a player/position swap. So, do the Ravens have at least three more picks than roster spots? Perhaps, but trading all of those extra picks to move up so far to get one guy who is no slam dunk is a risky business and one that bad teams make a lot. It's probably better to use those extra picks (5th, 6ht, 7th rounders) to maneuver in a round to get a guy they like. For example, trading up seven spots in the 3rd (from 91 to 84) to get Bernard Pierce, costing just a 5th rounder. Or trading up from #26 to #23 to get Michael Oher, costing just a 5th rounder. But packaging a #1, #2, + #4 (that's what it would take at a minimum to move up from 32 to 18) to get a guy that might be a solution severely limits your ability to move in the draft. Eleven picks, yes, but you can only maneuver with seven of them. Four of them are untradable.

**alien bird** · 02-06-2013, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by BigPlayReceiver

Hacked by DeAndre Hopkins!

Routes => Studman, Wheaton
Hands => Studman, Hopkins
Radius => Allen, Patterson, Hopkins

By Studman, I assume you mean Stedman Bailey?

**leachisabeast** · 02-06-2013, 02:49 PM

New York Giants have released Ahmad Bradshaw per Shefter.

**Justlovemybirds** · 02-06-2013, 02:52 PM

And Chris Canty

Ralph Vacchiano ‏@RVacchianoNYDN
I believe cutting DT Chris Canty saves the Giants $6.5M in cap space. With Bradshaw's $2.75M and Boley's $4.5M, total savings is $13.75M.

**jonboy79** · 02-06-2013, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by alien bird

Cutting Dickson would mean drafting another TE. Fine, but that's one of your 11 picks gone in a player/position swap. So, do the Ravens have at least three more picks than roster spots? Perhaps, but trading all of those extra picks to move up so far to get one guy who is no slam dunk is a risky business and one that bad teams make a lot. It's probably better to use those extra picks (5th, 6ht, 7th rounders) to maneuver in a round to get a guy they like. For example, trading up seven spots in the 3rd (from 91 to 84) to get Bernard Pierce, costing just a 5th rounder. Or trading up from #26 to #23 to get Michael Oher, costing just a 5th rounder. But packaging a #1, #2, + #4 (that's what it would take at a minimum to move up from 32 to 18) to get a guy that might be a solution severely limits your ability to move in the draft. Eleven picks, yes, but you can only maneuver with seven of them. Four of them are untradable.

In general, yes I agree. basically my point is that THIS IS THE YEAR to be aggressive. Don't sit around and "hope" the guy we like falls to us, when the value is right, go up and GET HIM. If we get 5 solid players out of this draft it will be perfect. If we get 11 marginal players it will be a disaster.

**leachisabeast** · 02-06-2013, 02:55 PM

Anyone interested in Chris Canty?

**BigPlayReceiver** · 02-06-2013, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by alien bird

By Studman, I assume you mean Stedman Bailey?

Yup. He's the one.

**alien bird** · 02-06-2013, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

In general, yes I agree. basically my point is that THIS IS THE YEAR to be aggressive. Don't sit around and "hope" the guy we like falls to us, when the value is right, go up and GET HIM. If we get 5 solid players out of this draft it will be perfect. If we get 11 marginal players it will be a disaster.

Well, that's the key - if the value is right. The Ravens do need to get some impact players, so trading a bunch of early round picks for one move up would probably be a mistake.

Besides, is it really true that LT is such an overwhelming need, even if McKinnie isn't resigned? Yes, the offensive line played lights out after moving McKinnie to LT, but that wasn't the only move. The much bigger move lost in all this (in my opinion) was Osemele to LG. He made just about every defensive lineman he faced his bitch. Total domination. So maybe it was the huge improvement to LG (over Jah Reid) that was the key.

Take a look at what Flacco was able to do as a result. Early in the season he never was able to step up into the pocket because the pocket was collapsing in the middle. After Osemele is moved inside, that pocket was really open to step into, and Flacco made big plays in doing so. McKinnie was able to push the edge rushers deep, but maybe another LT could do that, even if to a lesser degree. So all this talk about McKinnie being the key might just be wrong - maybe it was Osemele that made that line work.

**jonboy79** · 02-06-2013, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

Anyone interested in Chris Canty?

some... had more interest before he went to NY, before we got Art Jones and Mcphee...

NT is a bigger need in our front 3... so Knighton is my bi FA target if there is any movement at all.

**leachisabeast** · 02-06-2013, 03:20 PM

Originally Posted by jonboy79

some... had more interest before he went to NY, before we got Art Jones and Mcphee...

NT is a bigger need in our front 3... so Knighton is my bi FA target if there is any movement at all.

True, Arthur Jones really impresses me.

**jonboy79** · 02-06-2013, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by alien bird

Well, that's the key - if the value is right. The Ravens do need to get some impact players, so trading a bunch of early round picks for one move up would probably be a mistake.

Besides, is it really true that LT is such an overwhelming need, even if McKinnie isn't resigned? Yes, the offensive line played lights out after moving McKinnie to LT, but that wasn't the only move. The much bigger move lost in all this (in my opinion) was Osemele to LG. He made just about every defensive lineman he faced his bitch. Total domination. So maybe it was the huge improvement to LG (over Jah Reid) that was the key.

Take a look at what Flacco was able to do as a result. Early in the season he never was able to step up into the pocket because the pocket was collapsing in the middle. After Osemele is moved inside, that pocket was really open to step into, and Flacco made big plays in doing so. McKinnie was able to push the edge rushers deep, but maybe another LT could do that, even if to a lesser degree. So all this talk about McKinnie being the key might just be wrong - maybe it was Osemele that made that line work.

OK, so rephrasing... assumign Lane Johnson is a poor value target. I would then be interested in moving up in round 2 for Tavon Austin, or moving up in 3 to get Quessenberryor faulk, etc. Trading superfluous 4th, 5th and 6th round picks for these types of players would be "ideal".

And the scenario you lay out is EXACTLY why I think LT is such a big need. Without a legit LT, we could easily se an openind day roster such as Oher/Gino/Birk/Yanda/KO or maybe Oher/Reid/Gino/Birk/Yanda/KO or Oher/KO/Gino/Yanda/Reid... the iterations can go on, but it doesn't look pretty to me no matter how you slice it. Even with Big Mac in tow, you may see BigMac/KO/Gino/Yanda/Oher which is acceptable, but what is our depth behind that? Oher at LT, and Reid being the primary backup at all other spots... A well regarded LT prospect solves all of these issues. Let's say we come out of this draft with Quessenberry and Schwenke,, while retaining BigMac. See how much better our line is 8 deep? We would have legit competitions at LT and C with a pair of All-pro Guards and Oher/Reid at RT....

I think the key move was placing players ina position to succeed. KO was adequate at RT, but a MONSTER at LG. Oher was sufficient(my owrd for a bit worse then adequate, in this intance)at LT and pretty good at RT. McKinnie was quite good at LT, but sure, KO next to him helped him there. It's ok with me.

**Carey** · 02-06-2013, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

Anyone interested in Chris Canty?

Poissbly if it's a bargain after we handle all of our in house stuff. I think he's better as a 5 tech, and who wouldnt wanna come play for the champs?

**runrayrun27** · 02-06-2013, 03:31 PM

I'm a fan of Canty's size (6'7, 315). However, if they stick to a 3-4 then no, but if they switch to a 4-3 then I would say he could fit in nicely. I'm still a huge fan of the 4-3 idea

**GOTA** · 02-06-2013, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

Anyone interested in Chris Canty?

I'd rather go after Kyle Vanden Bosch

**runrayrun27** · 02-06-2013, 03:34 PM

Anyone have an interest in Brennan Williams UNC T. I could see him playing the left side in the NFL and would be probbaly 4th round-3rd round. Great project guy with a lor of upside

**The Excellector** · 02-06-2013, 03:40 PM

#1: The entire draft is a crap shoot. No one in the draft is a sure thing. Just, because you have eleven picks, doesn't mean your locked in to pick one right.

#2: Roll the dice with LT if you want to. Watch what happens.

**leachisabeast** · 02-06-2013, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

#1: The entire draft is a crap shoot. No one in the draft is a sure thing. Just, because you have eleven picks, doesn't mean your locked in to pick one right.

#2: Roll the dice with LT if you want to. Watch what happens.

**The Excellector** · 02-06-2013, 03:45 PM

I'm not saying move up for Johnson, just because. However, if, for example, you thought that somebody in this draft could be as good as you (Ozzie) thought Joe Thomas could be, this is the time to move up and take him.

That way, if the rookie isn't ready, you have McKinnie. If McKinnie pulls a McKinnie, you have the rookie and the rest of the line can remain intact.

**leachisabeast** · 02-06-2013, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

I'm not saying move up for Johnson, just because. However, if, for example, you thought that somebody in this draft could be as good as you (Ozzie) thought Joe Thomas could be, this is the time to move up and take him.

That way, if the rookie isn't ready, you have McKinnie. If McKinnie pulls a McKinnie, you have the rookie and the rest of the line can remain intact.

IDK man, I'd still rather take a more developmental player, than move up to take him. We need to get faster on D.