Cams protection packages in the second half got him fired according to Preston and Harbaugh.

[Boulderraven]

exactly he would zone his line and move cutler\plummer around to buy that time for that route to develop and there weren't deep shots, it was 5yrds there 7 yards here but it moved the chains constantly. It was a very good offense.

yep, but he would also take his shots too. They threw long more than people thought. He would take what was given, but would always force the defense to either come up and go deep or stay back and throw short crossing throws or have the Qb keep it.

[lowrider]

I think Joe is just fed up and in no man's land.

I ain't buying that. Joe has stated publically that he thinks he's an elite QB. I have never seen Brady, either Manning, Brees, or even Charlie Batch for that matter, run a play with that kind of a blocking mismatch in front of them. Elite QB's call time out, run the ball themselves, or just throw the ball out of bounds. Then they go to the sideline and have a heart-tp-heart with their OC. The play call was on Cam, the pick was due to a bad decision on Joe's part.

[Boulderraven]

I ain't buying that. Joe has stated publically that he thinks he's an elite QB. I have never seen Brady, either Manning, Brees, or even Charlie Batch for that matter, run a play with that kind of a blocking mismatch in front of them. Elite QB's call time out, run the ball themselves, or just throw the ball out of bounds. Then they go to the sideline and have a heart-tp-heart with their OC. The play call was on Cam, the pick was due to a bad decision on Joe's part.

Joe isnt that kind of FU kind of guy like a Manning, Elway, Unitas, Roethlisberger,Brady or Warner. He's not Alpha.

[ballhawk]

Plenty of NFL teams go 5 wide plenty of times.

I have no problem questioning the formation at that point of the game, or whether we/Joe can handle it, or the purpose of spreading Rice so wide, etc, but to pretend that 5 wide is something that never happens in the NFL is nonsense.

Off the top of my head i remember them running the same formation in week one against the steelers last year. They were in the RZ and the result was a Rice TD. Im not defending Cameeon, just pointing out that they have had success with it before.

[Boulderraven]

Off the top of my head i remember them running the same formation in week one against the steelers last year. They were in the RZ and the result was a Rice TD. Im not defending Cameeon, just pointing out that they have had success with it before.

Yes I do remember that play, I nearly fell out of my seat. Mckinney gave Joe time and he pumped to Rice in the flat. He wasnt set as wide as yesterday.

[The Excellector]

Boulderraven is right. Rice wasn't set out as wide on that play last year.

Yes, we have seen teams line up in that formation in the red zone. However, if anything, it's for one of those quick screens to Wes Welker that the Patriots run. It is usually for something quick. If they had Torrey lined up in the slot and shot him on a quick crossing route, it would have been different. They didn't. Rice was the closest option and it even took him a minute to get to where Joe wanted him to be.

Yes, Joe could have let go of the ball earlier, but even if Rice catches it, they are short of the first.

[JAB1985]

Plenty of NFL teams go 5 wide plenty of times.

but do they have all their receivers run 30 yards down field in that situation?

agreed that 5 wide is a basic NFL formation that all or at least most teams employ at some point.

[Ravenswintitle]

Perhaps having 5 blockers works in practice with Pees rushing 3 guys all the time.

winner.

Anyone notice how quickly Brady got rid of the ball last night? You couldn't count to two before it was gone

[Uli2001]

So one play got the OC fired? Right.

[NCRAVEN]

winner.

Anyone notice how quickly Brady got rid of the ball last night? You couldn't count to two before it was gone

The coaches there get it. Design plays that keeps your QB upright and you will succeed. Hopefully Caldwell gets it too.

[LC_Ravens_87]

Anyone notice how quickly Brady got rid of the ball last night? You couldn't count to two before it was gone

Can only force that square peg into a round hole so many times though. Flacco isn't Brady. Hell, Brady wasn't this version of Brady in his 5th year.

[Boulderraven]

So one play got the OC fired? Right.

No, but in the second half Cam's protection packages cost the Ravens at minimum 6 points in the #3rd Quarter. That resulted in a loss. That was just one obvious poor play design. Two turnovers in Redskin territory in the 3rd Q was essentially where the game was lost. Also in prior weeks Sd, Pitt his protection schemes were also poor. Remember if not for a miracle comeback in SD this is a 3 game losing streak. Cameron never adjusts but the opponet does. It doesnt take much for opposing defenses to figure the Ravens out. It's like the Bob Wade days at Maryland, teams didnt even scout MD cause they knew thier offense and defense the second time around. Those turnovers cost Cam his job in back to back weeks. They should have won both the last 2 games. Rumor is they wanted to replace him after the WIN in Pittsburgh.
They barely beat SD and Pitt two pretty bad teams when our defense was playing well. He also abandoned the sugar huddle designed for Joe for some reason, which gives Joe more options and decision time.

[jonboy79]

So one play got the OC fired? Right.

no, but the radio speculation, was that he was told repeatedly to give Flacco more blockers and chose not to, at the detriment of the team.

Laquan Williams on the Bernard Pollard show was characterizing Cam as a control freak, that was stubborn as could be. It sort of fed back into the old argument about if Flacco is EVEN ALLOWED to check off a play. He was basically saying matter of factly that Cladwell will empower Flacco to make more choices, adjustments and check offs at the line.

It makes sense to me. When i watch the Ravens play, I see Cam's playcalling as VERY stubborn in nature. It seems he draws up a game plan and sticks to it, NO MATTER WHAT, as if he knows it will work at some point. The definition of insanity is tryin ghte same thing over and ovr and expecting different results.

[GOTA]

I dont know you sir, but you have a very low football IQ. The game announcers mentioned it, Preston and HIS SOURCES, whoever they may be announced it. I pointed it out YESTERDAY. Now I have heard Aaron Wilson has now mentioned it, but I have not heard that first hand. 2 games IN A ROW lost because of protection issues, strip sacks and forced INT's all with leads. Protect the damn ball when leading.

If it was Preston and Wilson why is Harbaugh's name in the thread title?

[pslholder96]

If it was Preston and Wilson why is Harbaugh's name in the thread title?

LOL. Good Catch..Didn't even notice it.

[RichmondRaven]

I agree, that play call on 3rd down was atrocious for that point of the game. Now that Cam's gone (Christmas came early), my biggest concern is Joe's internal clock and awareness to certain situations on specific defensive looks. Its simple math really, 5 on the O-line, 6 to 7 players around the LOS in a 5 wide set. He has to realize that there is a 100% chance there will be contact on him this play and that he has about 2 seconds at most to get this play off. Furthermore, the pressure came from his field of vision, which makes me question his overall ability to catalog/decipher simple situations such as this one. Was it the best call, no, but he doesn't do himself any favors by looking like he has no idea that he is going to get hit.

[burnwood]

Joe isnt that kind of FU kind of guy like a Manning, Elway, Unitas, Roethlisberger,Brady or Warner. He's not Alpha.

Alpha? Certainly Brady isn't considered Alpha. Out of that list he isn't the only one either. Flacco doesn't deserve a pass. He's a grown man now.

[Dirt1]

Alpha? Certainly Brady isn't considered Alpha. Out of that list he isn't the only one either. Flacco doesn't deserve a pass. He's a grown man now.

On one hand people want to call Flacco an "elite" QB that the Ravens should give a $100+ million contract, and on the other hand they give him a pass for bad decision making. You can't have it both ways.

[lowrider]

Joe isnt that kind of FU kind of guy like a Manning, Elway, Unitas, Roethlisberger,Brady or Warner. He's not Alpha.

He's not alpha? Not sure what that has to do with making bad decisions, but any NFL QB who plays 5 years without missing a game due to injury, certainly can't be called a sissy. In fact I can't remember him even missing a play because of an injury. I say he's alpha+. But still made a bad decision on the play in question.

[bacchys]

winner.

Anyone notice how quickly Brady got rid of the ball last night? You couldn't count to two before it was gone

He has receivers running routes that are ready before you can count to two.

I haven't noticed any hot reads when other teams blitz with this offense under Cam. It's not just Flacco. The receivers aren't looking to change their routes based on the defense either, which leads me to believe the system under Cam just doesn't have that option. Either the O-line eats the blitz or the blitz eats Joe.

Which is nuts. I get it: the players need to execute. But that's setting them up for failure, especially if you're running a spread formation with an empty backfield. Any blitz scheme that sends more pass rushers than there are blockers is going to cause problems, especially when it's obvious the coaching has been to keep Flacco in the pocket. He may not be RGIII or Randall Cunningham, but we saw him run more during his first two years than he has since.

If Caldwell does nothing more than give Flacco opportunities to get rid of the ball quicker, he'll make this offense a lot more effective and efficient.