Good stuff from Greg Cosell on Cam after his dismissal

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 12-12-2012, 04:10 PM

He was on WNST this afternoon...I would highly recommend everyone check it out.

Link

**Random Thoughts** · 12-12-2012, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

He was on WNST this afternoon...I would highly recommend everyone check it out.

Link

I am Deaf, but can you give me a short synopsis?

**bmorecareful** · 12-12-2012, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by Random Thoughts

I am Deaf, but can you give me a short synopsis?

Nothing you've never heard before from plenty of posters on this board who are watching the games and actually comprehending what's happening. Here's a point by point summary:

Flacco is a good QB but the scheme makes him inconsistent. The receivers can't beat man coverage, which they see a lot of. The passing game is mostly intermediate and deep without short, easy throws. Flacco does not have one of the best internal clocks of any QB in the league and the combination of deep routes with his internal clock cause him to hold the ball.

The receivers only run isolation routes. The scheme makes no effort to help them beat man coverage with stack concepts, etc. The receivers lose the one on one battle more often than not. All the concepts and schemes to help the receivers beat man coverage are in the playbook, but they aren't being called.

The response to the OL's inability to pass block has mostly been to keep more eligible receivers in to block and reduce the number of receivers out in routes. This makes it much easier for the defense to defend only a few eligible receivers with lots of defenders.

There is not just one thing wrong with this offense, but if a few things were adjusted and corrected the offense would look much better.

"I have watched every throw Joe Flacco has made in the NFL, and 7 or 8 games of his last year in college. He is an extremely talented passer. His internal clock needs to get better, and his blitz recognition needs to get better. You wouldn't put him in that "elite" (whatever that means) category, but he has the strongest arm in the league and can make every throw. He is a good quarterback who needs to continue to get better."

He doesn't know what Caldwell's play-calling will be like because Caldwell's never called plays.

The Ravens have 2 good running backs, one great running back and one complementary back, and it might make sense for the Ravens to work off the run game to set up matchups in the pass game. That plays into this as well.

It is totally possible for the Ravens to both use the no huddle effectively and to control the clock with the run game (for example, the Patriots have the 3rd most rush attempts in the NFL.)

**JohnBKistler** · 12-12-2012, 04:37 PM

EDITED to only add the points that bmorecarelful may have missed in his excellent write-up:

Quick notes:
> Hard not to say Flacco is a "good" QB, only "what level of good"?
> Offense needs to be tailored to the type of QB and receivers on the Ravens.
> Flacco has a strong arm, but does not have a good "internal clock".
> Deeper throws to receivers who are not winning in man coverage = a not-very-mobile QB standing in the pocket waiting for receivers to get open. This leads to the inconsistent results.
> Can always help receivers vs. man coverage, and what he never saw, were those kinds of things (bunch formations, stack releases, shifts, motion, etc.)
> Instead saw isolation routes (which required receivers to win their matchups, which they frequently didn't).
> Suspects that the bunch formations, stack, releases, etc. are in the playbook (all teams have them). So it comes down to how and when to use them, which should be based on game-planning versus an opponent's tendencies and making in-game adjustments.
> Was "struck" that the no-huddle has "waned" since the success at the beginning of the season. Not sure why.

**Corey** · 12-12-2012, 04:42 PM

I think he was fair. And he think he summed up why Cam was fired without saying why he was fired. There are things that can be done to make our personnel more effective, Cam just wouldn't do it for whatever reason.

**HKusp** · 12-12-2012, 04:43 PM

bmorecareful and JBK, thank you for taking the time to summarize that.

**Sirdowski** · 12-12-2012, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Random Thoughts

I am Deaf, but can you give me a short synopsis?

In a nut shell:

There has been a disconnect between Cameron and his system and the actual players strengths that play in that system. The intermediate to deep passing game that our offense has almost exclusively featured makes it hard on our, for the most part, low skilled receivers to get open. This leads to a ton of man coverage and tough throws with very low margins of error. Bunch concepts, stack releases, motion, things that help receivers with man coverage, our offense doesn't utilize. Offensive line struggles can also be helped with different route schemes.

I've probably watched every throw Joe Flacco has thrown in his career and his last 7-8 games of his college career, Joe Flacco is an extremely talented passer. He needs to improve in blitz recognition and making quick reads, his internal clock needs to get better. He's got the strongest arm in the league he can throw as well as anyone. He needs to get better and can get better with help. Improving the run game will help with the better match ups for receivers by dictating coverages. It doesn't take much for a a QB like Joe Flacco to take that next step as a QB.

**SugarRay52** · 12-12-2012, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by Corey

I think he was fair. And he think he summed up why Cam was fired without saying why he was fired. There are things that can be done to make our personnel more effective, Cam just wouldn't do it for whatever reason.

Cam let his ego get in the way, he's a smart coach but a control freak.

**purplepoe** · 12-12-2012, 04:50 PM

"I have watched every throw Joe Flacco has made in the NFL, and 7 or 8 games of his last year in college. He is an extremely talented passer. His internal clock needs to get better, and his blitz recognition needs to get better. You wouldn't put him in that "elite" (whatever that means) category, but he has the strongest arm in the league and can make every throw. He is a good quarterback who needs to continue to get better."

This sums it up for me.

PP

**pslholder96** · 12-12-2012, 04:58 PM

Great stuff. Completely agree regarding Joe's internal clock but I think it's deficient to begin with because he was playing in a system that didn't require a quick internal clock. Hopefully we eliminate these isolation routes and get creative with our passing attacks. Speed up the tempo and and you'll speed up Joe's internal clock.

**bmoreraventerp** · 12-12-2012, 04:58 PM

Thanks for the summary. Gives some hope that the transition to Caldwell with the same playbook could work out extremely well for the offense and the team.

The stuff about Receivers vs man coverage and not beating the matchup sounds like when the team explains away the problems with saying players need to execute better. Players often do need to execute better but the coaches should also design/choose plays to help makes things easier for the players and to mask deficiencies as best as possible.

**bmorecareful** · 12-12-2012, 05:07 PM

Cosell is just a fantastic analyst. He knows football, period, and he has no qualms about letting people know that what they think is happening is not actually happening cuz film don't lie.

I've read everything he's written about the Ravens and it's all spot on. He's been tremendously critical of Cam throughout his entire tenure and has always said this offense is schemed terribly. I think he got as close to saying "Cam Cameron is a bad offensive coordinator" as he could without actually saying that.

I do find it interesting that he's VERY critical of our wide receivers in addition to the scheme. He said back in 2010 that we had the slowest WR corps in the league and not a single player could beat man coverage. He's still saying that now despite adding a lot of talent and speed with Torrey and Jacoby.

I still think the way the WRs have been coached--rounding off routes, etc.--is a huge factor in that. It's not as if we don't have talent at WR.

**SugarRay52** · 12-12-2012, 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

Cosell is just a fantastic analyst. He knows football, period, and he has no qualms about letting people know that what they think is happening is not actually happening cuz film don't lie.

I've read everything he's written about the Ravens and it's all spot on. He's been tremendously critical of Cam throughout his entire tenure and has always said this offense is schemed terribly. I think he got as close to saying "Cam Cameron is a bad offensive coordinator" as he could without actually saying that.

I do find it interesting that he's VERY critical of our wide receivers in addition to the scheme. He said back in 2010 that we had the slowest WR corps in the league and not a single player could beat man coverage. He's still saying that now despite adding a lot of talent and speed with Torrey and Jacoby.

I still think the way the WRs have been coached--rounding off routes, etc.--is a huge factor in that. It's not as if we don't have talent at WR.

I like Cosell too and he was the only person to blame Cam for the weak performance in the playoff game against Houston when the other media idiots destroyed Joe.

**The Excellector** · 12-12-2012, 05:54 PM

Greg Cosell has long had his issues with Cam Cameron's system. This time around, he was more careful about directly criticizing Cam Cameron. However, he has done so in the past.

He did a segment on ESPN Radio the Monday following the Ravens playoff victory over the Texans, saying "Ed Reed needs to shut up", in response to Reed's criticism of Joe Flacco, explaining how difficult it has been for Flacco to succeed in Cameron's essentially archaic system.

If I were to summarize his issues with each aspect of the offense:

Cameron: His administration of the system is too aged and strenuous on the players, not playing to their strengths

Flacco: His internal clock needs to improve

WRs: Need to do a better job of beating man coverage

Offensive Line: Struggles in pass protection.

In short, you have a circle effect. The WRs aren't getting open. The line isn't blocking for the deep throws to develop. Joe isn't helping the line with his internal clock. The WRs aren't helping Joe. The scheme isn't helping anybody.

**RavenScallywag** · 12-12-2012, 06:06 PM

It's good to hear this...

I've been really concerned as of late that Joe really has been ruined. Hopefully, with a fresh set of eyes calling the plays, we can see his development get back on track. I don't expect him ever to put his name among Brady or Manning or Brees. But he's definitely an above average QB who can do enough things on offense along with other components to put something good on the field.

**LukeDaniel** · 12-12-2012, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

I still think the way the WRs have been coached--rounding off routes, etc.--is a huge factor in that. It's not as if we don't have talent at WR.

Could that be why it seems like Flacco is always overthrowing Torrey on those 15-20 yard sideline routes?

**Ravenswintitle** · 12-12-2012, 06:53 PM

I've always been a little cynical towards Cossell because he completely dismisses the system but he pretty much nailed it. And thanks guys for summarizing.

**BigPlayReceiver** · 12-12-2012, 06:54 PM

Love me some Greg Cosell.

**leachisabeast** · 12-12-2012, 06:55 PM

As usual he is correct about everything.

I will say this though, WR's struggling to get separation vs press may have been a pure talent issue in 2010, but now with the likes of Torrey Smith, this HAS to be a coaching issue IMO, as well as a scheme issue.

**bacchys** · 12-12-2012, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by pslholder96

Great stuff. Completely agree regarding Joe's internal clock but I think it's deficient to begin with because he was playing in a system that didn't require a quick internal clock. Hopefully we eliminate these isolation routes and get creative with our passing attacks. Speed up the tempo and and you'll speed up Joe's internal clock.

I don't know how well you can judge Joe's internal clock when it's a rare play that provides a quick safety outlet. He either has to hold the ball or throw it away if the receivers don't quickly beat their man, and he definitely prefers to make a play than just throw it away.

That thread awhile back that linked a site explaining the difference between Home Joe and Road Joe noted he seemed more comfortable holding the ball and shifting around in the pocket when he's in The Vault. He's been more willing to let the play develop, and that takes time. We need more plays, or at least more options, for a quick pass, I think, before we start assuming the problem is Flacco doesn't feel the pass rush well enough.