77% of us will have higher taxes

[HoustonRaven]

.... thanks to the cliff deal, so says The Tax Policy Center.

I am thinking we're going to see a steep increase in membership in the Libertarian party.

[NCRAVEN]

Saw a picture on facebook this morning that said "the only difference between a democrat and republican, is what they do with your money after they steal it".

I am convinced there is no difference between the two parties anymore. The whole left vs, right, dem vs. repub, is just a show (not like a man behind the curtain, or Alex Jones the "global elite" are controlling things) that makes it look like somebody is on our side.

What happened here always happens, one side takes one position and the other takes theirs, it comes down to the last minute the citizens get all worked up and whatever side caves hides under the cover of "we were out of time, this was the best we could get". In the end we're the one getting screwed, always!

I wish more people would join the libertarian party, but I think there are just too many, stupid, ignorant lazy people to think past "Democrat good, republican bad"

[jonboy79]

is that 77% of people tha tpay taxes, or it's taking into account that many that don't currently will have to soon? Or that some will receive less from the EITC.

[JAB1985]

I wish more people would join the libertarian party, but I think there are just too many, stupid, ignorant lazy people to think past "Democrat good, republican bad"

or vice versa to be fair.

i do feel the libertarian party is gaining momentum, which is a good thing, but like you said partys in general are the down fall. Not sure what the best solution is, but im all for a 3 party system until it gets figured out, these 2 party systems arent working. could easily be candidate selection as well as it is typically described as picking "the lesser of two evils". Thats not how it should be.

ive seen a few people complaining about Obama giving congress a raise, but i find it funny that we were at a complete stalemate until he did. both sides seem to be greedy and corrupt and very few are actually "representing" their actual constituents best interests it seems.

is that 77% of people tha tpay taxes, or it's taking into account that many that don't currently will have to soon? Or that some will receive less from the EITC.

Senate today would raise taxes on 77.1 percent of U.S. households, mostly because of the expiration of a payroll tax cut, according to preliminary estimates from the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center in Washington.

the payroll tax cut is apparently 2% which is what mostly accounts for the 77%. so what you make X 2% is roughly what it should raise for under the 400/450 incomes. Unless im missing something else?

[HoustonRaven]

True, I don't think many in the MSM were upset about the now dead Congressional pay raise. But if you read the right wing side of the media, it's all they were talking about for a couple of weeks.

Also, part of that comes in the timing. I don't think it's a coincidence that the President would use an executive order, during the painfully slow holiday news cycle, to try and ram through the pay raise.

I am glad there was a vocal few Democrats who said no way to the pay increase.

[NCRAVEN]

or vice versa to be fair.

i do feel the libertarian party is gaining momentum, which is a good thing, but like you said partys in general are the down fall. Not sure what the best solution is, but im all for a 3 party system until it gets figured out, these 2 party systems arent working. could easily be candidate selection as well as it is typically described as picking "the lesser of two evils". Thats not how it should be.

ive seen a few people complaining about Obama giving congress a raise, but i find it funny that we were at a complete stalemate until he did. both sides seem to be greedy and corrupt and very few are actually "representing" their actual constituents best interests it seems.

I only did "dem good, repub bad" because the majority of the media enforces that, but it does go both ways.

And I agree with the bolded part. I am so tired of congress coming back to the people they are supposed to represent and telling us why they voted a certain way, we send them there to vote for us. No one seems to care, or at least not enough, maybe because a lot people think we're a democracy...? I don't know... Just fed up.

[Dade]

.... thanks to the cliff deal, so says The Tax Policy Center.

I am thinking we're going to see a steep increase in membership in the Libertarian party.

I'm already there.

[AirFlacco]

That's OK. I don't mind paying more taxes. That's what Galen always said as other libbies I know.

The economists across the ideological spectrum call the deal a dud. No on likes it, not the Keynesians who want more taxes and printed money to mobilize industry and not the conservatives who want less taxes to ignite industry. OBY of course was in
the higher taxes group. Boner just held on to his speaker's seat. Many thought he'd lose it after caving in.

http://www.cnn.com/


I voted Libertarian and JOhnson didn't come close to getting the 5% he needed for public campaign contributions. It won't matter how many people join the Libertarian Party. The Spanish vote will determine all future elections which is
why Rubio or Jeb Bush will run the next time. Rubio is Spanish and popular and in office getting their vote and Jeb won two terms as Florida guv getting the Spanish vote.

Mitt just missed their vote in Florida by .9 of a point.


http://business.time.com/2013/01/03/...al-cliff-deal/

[AirFlacco]

And after pretending to protect the middle class from the ruthless rich, this is what the DEMs will
cost the average working middle class stiff and this is what they deserve. They voted for him.


And some people wonder why I mock the DEMs.


_______________________________________________________________
The deal was less kind to the middle class. Congress permitted a cut in the payroll tax to expire, meaning that the tax burden for the average worker will increase about $1,000 in 2013.
_________________________________________________________

[JAB1985]

And after pretending to protect the middle class from the ruthless rich, this is what the DEMs will
cost the average working middle class stiff and this is what they deserve. They voted for him.


And some people wonder why I mock the DEMs.


_______________________________________________________________
The deal was less kind to the middle class. Congress permitted a cut in the payroll tax to expire, meaning that the tax burden for the average worker will increase about $1,000 in 2013.
_________________________________________________________

Except thats leaving out that Romney would have cost them this plus even more deductions...

whats the saying, "only things youre guaranteed in life are death and taxes." I dont care what "side" youre on, youre going to be paying taxes no matter what.

[HoustonRaven]

whats the saying, "only things youre guaranteed in life are death and taxes." I dont care what "side" youre on, youre going to be paying taxes no matter what.

True but neither side ever argued no taxes.

It wasn't too long ago (in the 90's) both sides actively sought a balanced budget. Bush and his 2 years of party control in congress ruined that (aided by war) and took us into the red. Not to be outdone, Obama took us even further, doubling what W did in a mere 4 years.

Now, one side can't spend enough and the other are too chicken shit to stop the spending. NO country has ever taxed and spent their way to prosperity.

We're in deep shit right now, having a debt of over $16 Trillion (with only $15 Trillion in circulation). That bill is going to need to get paid eventually. In the meantime, we better hope nothing serious breaks out in the world and we have to defend ourselves. Right now, we can't afford it. Literally.

[wickedsolo]

Saw a picture on facebook this morning that said "the only difference between a democrat and republican, is what they do with your money after they steal it".

I am convinced there is no difference between the two parties anymore. The whole left vs, right, dem vs. repub, is just a show (not like a man behind the curtain, or Alex Jones the "global elite" are controlling things) that makes it look like somebody is on our side.

What happened here always happens, one side takes one position and the other takes theirs, it comes down to the last minute the citizens get all worked up and whatever side caves hides under the cover of "we were out of time, this was the best we could get". In the end we're the one getting screwed, always!

I wish more people would join the libertarian party, but I think there are just too many, stupid, ignorant lazy people to think past "Democrat good, republican bad"

[wickedsolo]

True, I don't think many in the MSM were upset about the now dead Congressional pay raise. But if you read the right wing side of the media, it's all they were talking about for a couple of weeks.

Also, part of that comes in the timing. I don't think it's a coincidence that the President would use an executive order, during the painfully slow holiday news cycle, to try and ram through the pay raise.

I am glad there was a vocal few Democrats who said no way to the pay increase.

Speaking of executive orders...

I read that Obama has had something like 800+ executive orders since taking office in 2008 versus 30 something from W in 2 terms. That's pretty incredible.

[wickedsolo]

The reality is that there should be NO parties. Every man for himself, I say.

When you start adhering to an overarching political agenda then your own beliefs and values get skewed to meet the masses. It's bogus and it dumbs the average American down.

[JAB1985]

True but neither side ever argued no taxes.

not saying they did, merely that mocking somebody for voting for somebody and then having to pay them is pretty weak when considering its going to happen regardless who is in office. Goes back to NC's quote that wicked just quoted.

It wasn't too long ago (in the 90's) both sides actively sought a balanced budget. Bush and his 2 years of party control in congress ruined that (aided by war) and took us into the red. Not to be outdone, Obama took us even further, doubling what W did in a mere 4 years.

Now, one side can't spend enough and the other are too chicken shit to stop the spending. NO country has ever taxed and spent their way to prosperity.

We're in deep shit right now, having a debt of over $16 Trillion (with only $15 Trillion in circulation). That bill is going to need to get paid eventually. In the meantime, we better hope nothing serious breaks out in the world and we have to defend ourselves. Right now, we can't afford it. Literally.

pretty much summed up the difference between working together and being divided. Thats probably the biggest issue out of everything, even the debt. The debt is something we can fix, IF, we work together. Seems congress will only work together when given a deadline and then its only at the last minute and throwing something together.

The reality is that there should be NO parties. Every man for himself, I say.

When you start adhering to an overarching political agenda then your own beliefs and values get skewed to meet the masses. It's bogus and it dumbs the average American down.

that entails they actually do their jobs, which to this point very few seem to actually want to. Much easier just to vote the party line and kick it in your office (or anywhere) on tax payer dollars.

[Sirdowski]

The reality is that there should be NO parties. Every man for himself, I say.

When you start adhering to an overarching political agenda then your own beliefs and values get skewed to meet the masses. It's bogus and it dumbs the average American down.

I don't think that's the reality simply because it could never be a reality.

There will always be compromise to meet the masses. The problem is the lack of political fidelity. The more people there are, the larger the disconnect between the little guy and his supposed representative, and the easier it is for politicians to act without recourse. That's what happens when you have a country of 300 mill. people. History repeats it's self, power is corrupt.


My take personally, state succession is our only chance. We are getting too diverse and too massive to expect anything to get done within our government anymore. How can we expect politicians to agree and to get things done when they disagree on the most fundamental levels of what the governments job is?

[HoustonRaven]

Twitter and FB have been abuzz about a new tax people are just discovering, thanks to Obamacare .....

It's called the "Medical Excise Tax" and people are not happy.

This has been verified by snopes.com as being legit and not some register glitch.

Clothing falls under this definition so that's a national 2.3% tax whenever you have buy some clothing.

[NCRAVEN]

I don't think that's the reality simply because it could never be a reality.

There will always be compromise to meet the masses. The problem is the lack of political fidelity. The more people there are, the larger the disconnect between the little guy and his supposed representative, and the easier it is for politicians to act without recourse. That's what happens when you have a country of 300 mill. people. History repeats it's self, power is corrupt.


My take personally, state succession is our only chance. We are getting too diverse and too massive to expect anything to get done within our government anymore. How can we expect politicians to agree and to get things done when they disagree on the most fundamental levels of what the governments job is?

I tend to agree. And I think it will ultimately come to that, maybe not in our lifetime.

[Sirdowski]

One way or the other this country is going to be very different.

[wickedsolo]

A lot of states like Oklahoma, Texas, Missouri, and Kansas are, in a sense, setting themselves up for secession. It could absolutely happen.