Dear Mr Caldwell, why did you run on 10/12 first downs in the first half

[pslholder96]

I honestly think the first half play calling was deliberate, I think they didn't want to show bilecheck nothing and keep it close. We know bliecheck is the master at 2nd half adjustment and caldwell showed him nothing to adjust to then they openned up the playbook and Joee took off. It stunned that whole Pats team they couldn't adjust at all at one point Bilecheck had a blank stare on his face. I believe it was all part of the strategy.

This. Sometimes you need to feel the defenses out and run plays that end up going only a few yards to keep the defense honest. It goes to show how much trust the coaches with both sides of the ball

[Haloti92]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...gn=Twitter_atl

I still don't like the idea that Joe is prevented from "cutting loose" from the opening whistle. But that is just me. And again, whatever they did, it worked, but I am not sure shackling Joe for a half necessarily made it any easier on him in the second half once they "cut him loose." But maybe it did, like Jsmoove said.

[RavensRule21215]

lol..i guess we can't always get what we want huh? I mean besides heading to new orleans and beating the Pats by 15 points. eh, such is life. i've seen plenty of 'creative' play calling from this team in the past few years and quite frankly i'm sick of it. maybe if you were more specific i'd understand what kind of play calling you're referring to. end arounds, the cam special? sweeps? what?

No, not that kind of stuff. I'm talking about a more creative way of mixing the runs and p/a passes, so that every play doesn't start with a run. And putting Joe in the shotgun, TAKING the offense to the defense, rather than taking what the defense gives. Those sorts of things. Putting the ball in Joe's hands and letting him win games, rather than painting him into corners then challenging him to work his way out. (Side note: Eliminating stupid S/T penalties would also go a long way to keep Ravens drives from starting inside their own 20 yard line.)

[Jsmoove]

This. Sometimes you need to feel the defenses out and run plays that end up going only a few yards to keep the defense honest. It goes to show how much trust the coaches with both sides of the ball

exactly my dude, now that I had time to digest this game Ravens came up with an unorthodox game plan, even on D we didn't get much pressure on brady but I don't think that was the plan there, they wanted to keep everything in front of them then punish the ball carrier, those guys were hitting and hitting hard they were gonna create turnovers by belting recievers and running backs and then the Pats finally cracked. Harbaugh learned this time around. It didn't start out pretty but it ended beautiful.

[Raven 555]

When Caldwell was forced to open his offense up early by Trindon Holiday and Peyton marching up and down the field in Denver, he did, and did so with gusto. But as long as the D is keep the opponent in check, his MO is to keep the game close in the first half, and then hit 'em with both barrels in the second to pull away.

And once again, you can bitch and moan that it makes for unpleasant football viewing, but you CANNOT IN ANY REASONABLE WAY ARGUE WITH HIS RESULTS.

You are doing fine. Don't give up the ship!

[Paintballguy]

I still don't like the idea that Joe is prevented from "cutting loose" from the opening whistle. But that is just me. And again, whatever they did it worked, but I am not sure shackling Joe for a half necessarily made it any easier on him in the second half once they "cut him loose." But maybe it did, like Jsmoove said.

I don't either, but I trust Caldwell.

[bacchys]

That's 7 plays with minimal production. But hey...you're satisfied? Great.

This isn't Madden. Throwing it down the field for maximum gain every play is generally a losing strategy in the NFL.

The Coryell isn't a complicated concept. Pound the ball. Use short to medium passes to move the chains if Step 1 doesn't do it. Throw it over the top when the defense tries to take away the run.

Run it twice for two yards each, and you're in third and six. That's a manageable distance. It's easier to get a first down on third and six than it is third and 8 or 10. You also get the benefit that your offensive line is attacking their defensive front instead of taking the hits as they do in pass protection.

All too often under Cameron the offense would abandon the run because they'd throw on first down for an incomplete, and then had to throw on second and third. I wouldn't mind having some playaction mixed in instead of just run-run-pass, but I don't want to see pass-pass-pass on most series. It's not as effective, and the offensive system doesn't work well that way.

I am satisfied with running the ball on first and second when it gets you into third and short on a regular basis.

[Jsmoove]

I still don't like the idea that Joe is prevented from "cutting loose" from the opening whistle. But that is just me. And again, whatever they did, it worked, but I am not sure shackling Joe for a half necessarily made it any easier on him in the second half once they "cut him loose." But maybe it did, like Jsmoove said.

I don't think they shackled Joe, i think the Ravens were playing "dummy" I think they baited Bilicheck and it worked because Pats made no 2nd half adjustments this is where they are dangerous, but there was nothing to adjust to because Ravens didn't show shit. 2nd half it when the Ravens shook the powder off and blasted them with an element of surprise.

[RavensRule21215]

I still don't like the idea that Joe is prevented from "cutting loose" from the opening whistle. But that is just me. And again, whatever they did, it worked, but I am not sure shackling Joe for a half necessarily made it any easier on him in the second half once they "cut him loose."

This is exactly what I'm saying as well.

[bacchys]

I don't think they shackled Joe, i think the Ravens were playing "dummy" I think they baited Bilicheck and it worked because Pats made no 2nd half adjustments this is where they are dangerous, but there was nothing to adjust to because Ravens didn't show shit. 2nd half it when the Ravens shook the powder off and blasted them with an element of surprise.

I don't think they were playing dumb or "rope a dope" (the pregame call from Ali notwithstanding). I think the object was to beat the crap out of the Patriots physically on both sides of the ball.

Harbaugh is taking a page out of the 2000 playbook. We may not have the players we had then, but the Ravens decided they were the more physical team on the field and to take advantage of it.

[Haloti92]

I don't think they shacked Joe, i think the Ravens were playing "dummy" I think they baited Bilicheck and it worked because Pats made no 2nd half adjustments this is where they are dangerous, but there was nothing to adjust to because Ravens didn't show shit. 2nd half it when the Ravens shook the powder off and blasted them with an element of surprise.

I know that is what you meant. But Harbaugh said they made a conscious decision to "let Joe loose" in the second half. That implies (the word 'let' combined with 'loose') that before that decision they were purposely keeping him shackled (i.e. not loose). In any event, like I said, it worked, whether it was preordained to do it that way or whether they did it on the fly.

[Jsmoove]

I know that is what you meant. But Harbaugh said they made a conscious decision to "let Joe loose" in the second half. That implies (the word 'let' combined with 'loose') that before that decision they were purposefully keeping him shackled (i.e. not loose). In any event, like I said, it worked, whether it was preordained to do it that way or whether they did it on the fly.

I see what you're saying but bouy we can't argue with the results. Either way it worked.

[RavensRule21215]

I know that is what you meant. But Harbaugh said they made a conscious decision to "let Joe loose" in the second half. That implies (the word 'let' combined with 'loose') that before that decision they were purposely keeping him shackled (i.e. not loose). In any event, like I said, it worked, whether it was preordained to do it that way or whether they did it on the fly.

IIRC, some Ravens player said the same thing about either the Colts game or the Broncos game (that the first half was intentionally conservative). If that's how they want to play it, and it works, fine. But it seems unnecessary to me. And not without risk. Because if/when they come up against a team that's steam rolling the Ravens D in the first half, I don't think we're going to like the end result very much.

[Raven 555]

I don't think they were playing dumb or "rope a dope" (the pregame call from Ali notwithstanding). I think the object was to beat the crap out of the Patriots physically on both sides of the ball.

Harbaugh is taking a page out of the 2000 playbook. We may not have the players we had then, but the Ravens decided they were the more physical team on the field and to take advantage of it.

Said that last week. If you hit the Patriots in the mouth, they fold real quick.

[ActualSpamBot]

Because if/when they come up against a team that's steam rolling the Ravens D in the first half, I don't think we're going to like the end result.

You mean like when Denver scored 28 against us in the first 30 minutes and 12 seconds of the divisional round game and we kept up? You know, that example I've used at least twice now to challenge the idea that this team is unable or unwilling to open the playbook up earlier in the game should circumstances dictate? Do you mean like that?

[Ravenalytics]

I have no problem running it on first down, but I wish we had done more stretch plays just to spread them out and run a bit.

[MarkS]

First half:

1st and 10 at BAL 13 R.Rice right guard to BLT 15 for 2 yards (B.Spikes).
1st and 10 at BAL 27 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 30 for 3 yards (J.Francis).
1st and 10 at BAL 10 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 13 for 3 yards (D.Hightower).
1st and 10 at BAL 33 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Rice up the middle to BLT 35 for 2 yards (M.Cole; R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at BAL 46 (No Huddle) R.Rice left end to BLT 48 for 2 yards (R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at NE 44 (No Huddle) B.Pierce right end pushed ob at NE 40 for 4 yards (A.Dennard).
1st and 10 at BAL 14 B.Pierce right end ran ob at BLT 13 for -1 yards.

That's 7 plays, for a whopping 15 yards.

THAT'S the game I was watching. What game were YOU watching?

The game I was watching didn't selectively edit out the good runs. Here's the complete list:


1st and 10 at BAL 13 R.Rice right guard to BLT 15 for 2 yards (B.Spikes).
1st and 10 at BAL 27 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 30 for 3 yards (J.Francis).
1st and 10 at BAL 8 B.Pierce left tackle to BLT 19 for 11 yards (A.Dennard).
1st and 10 at BAL 19 B.Pierce left end to BLT 22 for 3 yards (R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at BAL 10 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 13 for 3 yards (D.Hightower).
1st and 10 at BAL 33 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Rice up the middle to BLT 35 for 2 yards (M.Cole; R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at BAL 46 (No Huddle) R.Rice left end to BLT 48 for 2 yards (R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at NE 44 (No Huddle) B.Pierce right end pushed ob at NE 40 for 4 yards (A.Dennard).
1st and 10 at NE 15 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Rice left guard to NE 7 for 8 yards (D.McCourty; K.Arrington).
1st and 10 at BAL 14 B.Pierce right end ran ob at BLT 13 for -1 yards.

10 runs, 3.6 YPC. Not great, but not as bad as you'd want us to believe.

Also, to the argument that we put ourselves in a lot of 3rd and longs from running the ball too much back-to-back on 1st and 2nd down: That actually only happened 4 times in the 1st half, and here were the results:
- 3rd and 4 twice
- 3rd and 6
- 1st down
None of those are 3rd and long (I might give you the 3rd and 6 though, it's kind of borderline)

[ActualSpamBot]

The game I was watching didn't selectively edit out the good runs. Here's the complete list:


1st and 10 at BAL 13 R.Rice right guard to BLT 15 for 2 yards (B.Spikes).
1st and 10 at BAL 27 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 30 for 3 yards (J.Francis).
1st and 10 at BAL 8 B.Pierce left tackle to BLT 19 for 11 yards (A.Dennard).
1st and 10 at BAL 19 B.Pierce left end to BLT 22 for 3 yards (R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at BAL 10 R.Rice up the middle to BLT 13 for 3 yards (D.Hightower).
1st and 10 at BAL 33 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Rice up the middle to BLT 35 for 2 yards (M.Cole; R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at BAL 46 (No Huddle) R.Rice left end to BLT 48 for 2 yards (R.Ninkovich).
1st and 10 at NE 44 (No Huddle) B.Pierce right end pushed ob at NE 40 for 4 yards (A.Dennard).
1st and 10 at NE 15 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Rice left guard to NE 7 for 8 yards (D.McCourty; K.Arrington).
1st and 10 at BAL 14 B.Pierce right end ran ob at BLT 13 for -1 yards.

10 runs, 3.6 YPC. Not great, but not as bad as you'd want us to believe.

Also, to the argument that we put ourselves in a lot of 3rd and longs from running the ball too much back-to-back on 1st and 2nd down: That happened 4 times in the 1st half, resulting in 3rd and 4 twice, a 3rd and 6, and one 1st down. None of those are 3rd and long (I might give you the 3rd and 6 though, it's kind of borderline)

[Haloti92]

You mean like when Denver scored 28 against us in the first 30 minutes and 12 seconds of the divisional round game and we kept up? You know, that example I've used at least twice now to challenge the idea that this team is unable or unwilling to open the playbook up earlier in the game should circumstances dictate? Do you mean like that?

Right. When we were down by 7, 70 yards away from the endzone, with 41 seconds left, and no timeouts, we had them right where we wanted them.

Like last year's Evans "drop." Couldn't have used an extra early TD there either.

The fact is, there is a risk to seemingly purposely not trying your hardest to score points early in the game. You get a certain number of drives in a game. That number is finite. It is absolutely possible you can come up one drive/possession short. And of course it puts more pressure on those later drives if they are "must score" drives due to being behind, rather than "inscrease/take the lead" drives. It also obviously puts pressure on your defense to not allow the opponent to keep pace with your second half scoring.

All that said, again, if somehow the early "safe" or "wear them down" strategy that seems to reduce our early scoring (due to safe play) actually increases our total points scored in a full game (by somehow making it much easier to score later) then obviously I am fine with it. But I just am not necessarily convinced that this is the case. I think Joe could score early and often and keep it up, assuming that all game we were calling the kind of mix we were calling in the 3rd and early 4th quarters of last night's game. And that doesn't mean I want to throw it every down, as we were still running in the 3rd and early 4th yesterday.

My opinion, and obviously you and others disagree.

[RavensRule21215]

Right. When we were down by 7, 70 yards away from the endzone, with 41 seconds left, and no timeouts, we had them right where we wanted them.

Like last year's Evans "drop." Couldn't have used an extra early TD there either.

The fact is, there is a risk to seemingly purposely not trying your hardest to score points early in the game. You get a certain number of drives in a game. That number is finite. It is absolutely possible you can come up one drive/possession short. And of course it puts more pressure on those later drives if they are "must score" drives due to being behind, rather than "inscrease/take the lead" drives. It also obviously puts pressure on your defense to not allow the opponent to keep pace with your second half scoring.

All that said, again, if somehow the early "safe" or "wear them down" strategy that seems to reduce our early scoring (due to safe play) actually increases our total points scored in a full game (by somehow making it much easier to score later) then obviously I am fine with it. But I just am not necessarily convinced that this is the case. I think Joe could score early and often and keep it up, assuming that all game we were calling the kind of mix we were calling in the 3rd and early 4th quarters of last night's game. And that doesn't mean I want to throw it every down, as we were still running in the 3rd and early 4th yesterday.

My opinion, and obviously you and others disagree.