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  1. #61
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    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders



    Quote Originally Posted by B-more Ravor View Post
    Exactly. Once you factor in tickets for the owner and upper level staff, the FO, the coaches, players and corporate sponsors, there's likely very little left..........then, the Suite holders, then the club level, then the "regular" PSL holders.

    There's simply not that many to go around.
    I mean, that's why it is a lottery. Not everyone wins it.

    Does everyone who purchases a mega millions jackpot whatever lottery ticket win some money? Nope.
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  2. #62

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    I am fine with the Suite Holders getting 8-tickets. I am also okay with Club Level having a better shot at winning the Super Bowl lottery. The big bucks these people spend help put a better product on the field allowing us to reach the Super Bowl plus, their expensive seats allow the rest of the stadium seats to be "a little" more reasonably priced.

    With such a limited pool left for "regular PSL holders", I do believe it would be more fair if people who have won the lottery before were not included in this lottery. I have heard of at least one "regular PSL holder" winning both lotteries now for the Ravens Super Bowl trips. I certainly don't blame them for going to both, I certainly would if I had won both times. However, it would be nice if the Ravens made previous lottery winners ineligible to win in the future until all PSL holders have had an opportunity to get Super Bowl tickets.
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  3. #63
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    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    I mean, that's why it is a lottery. Not everyone wins it.

    Does everyone who purchases a mega millions jackpot whatever lottery ticket win some money? Nope.
    What!?!? You mean if I play the lottery, I won't win!?!?!? WTF!!!
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  4. #64

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by ManfredHanover View Post
    A list of lottery winners by Section would be nice to see.
    We are going round-and-round here, but I have to ask: To what purpose?

    You will see just about 1:1 for club seat holders...and then other winners sprinkled in sections here and there. From the last Super Bowl, I personally know a friend that had nose-bleed seats and he won the lottery...and there have been several others on these message board that have won this time.

    To me, the bigger "shaft" would be if the Ravens just paid lip service to the lottery and were giving all the tickets away to suite holders. They are not...there just aren't that many tickets available.

    I am disappointed I didn't win the lottery, too...but I guess I wasn't really expecting to win it either.




  5. #65

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    I mean, that's why it is a lottery. Not everyone wins it.

    Does everyone who purchases a mega millions jackpot whatever lottery ticket win some money? Nope.
    Right, but certainly the Ravens know how many tickets they gave away to the PSL holders? So why don't we know the number. Why not just provide the info? You said probably 5,000. What if you found out it was 500?

    I personally think the Ravens can do whatever they want with the tickets, but I also think someone has a right to criticize the team if it appears they are overly-favoring less loyal, more-able-to-afford-secondary-market-prices, cronies in terms of ticket allocation. And I am not sure they are, but without the numbers or lottery mechanics (club seats get 2 ping pong balls to regular seats 1 ping pong ball? or 10 to 1? etc) it is impossible to rule it out.




  6. #66

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by OC Bob View Post
    With such a limited pool left for "regular PSL holders", I do believe it would be more fair if people who have won the lottery before were not included in this lottery. I have heard of at least one "regular PSL holder" winning both lotteries now for the Ravens Super Bowl trips. I certainly don't blame them for going to both, I certainly would if I had won both times. However, it would be nice if the Ravens made previous lottery winners ineligible to win in the future until all PSL holders have had an opportunity to get Super Bowl tickets.
    I think that is fair, but I am not sure exactly how easy that would be to enforce...not saying it's not doable, but wonder how easy, since you need to do the lottery right away after the Championship game to give people enough time to make travel arrangements.

    The other thing I think they should do is make the tickets non-transferable (I believe the 49ers do this). So if you win the lottery, great, you can go...but if you don't want to use the tickets, they should go back into the pool for other PSL holders.

    I guess the Ravens are just going to have to keep going to Super Bowls....somebody, start writing letters!
    Last edited by JohnBKistler; 01-22-2013 at 02:50 PM.




  7. #67
    It would also help the average fan if they found a way to limit the brokers who own a vast amount of seats to only have 5 entries. Or limit (or heavily tax) brokers for having seats in general.

    I did not win. I only have a pair of LL PSLs. Would have scraped together cash to go if I was selected. It's hurts to know that some dude in Virginia that owns 25 seats or so for profit, probably got the tixs just to re-sell. I hope that his golden ticket went to spam.




  8. #68
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    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    Right, but certainly the Ravens know how many tickets they gave away to the PSL holders? So why don't we know the number. Why not just provide the info? You said probably 5,000. What if you found out it was 500?

    I personally think the Ravens can do whatever they want with the tickets, but I also think someone has a right to criticize the team if it appears they are overly-favoring less loyal, more-able-to-afford-secondary-market-prices, cronies in terms of ticket allocation. And I am not sure they are, but without the numbers or lottery mechanics (club seats get 2 ping pong balls to regular seats 1 ping pong ball? or 10 to 1? etc) it is impossible to rule it out.
    Then I would say that those 500 were lucky and I hoped they had a good time! What else can I say?

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the PSL agreement says that as an added bonus they'll be added to a lottery drawing for Super Bowl tix if the situation arises...nothing says that the Ravens HAVE to do that. It is a bonus for being a PSL. And frankly, considering that tickets are going for nearly $3,000 a pop right now, I'd gladly pay the face value of $850 if given the chance.

    Maybe it isn't even a set number? Maybe after the players, front office, coaches, etc all put in how many they want/need, the leftovers get sent out via lottery.

    The Superdome seats roughly 72,000 people. Take away 26,000 for each team and you have 46,000 tickets that the public can go buy. I don't know how other teams operate, I would assume it is the same way, but the fact that the Ravens are willing to give a percentage of their tickets to PSL owners is a really nice gesture IMO.
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  9. #69

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBKistler View Post
    We are going round-and-round here, but I have to ask: To what purpose?

    You will see just about 1:1 for club seat holders...and then other winners sprinkled in sections here and there. From the last Super Bowl, I personally know a friend that had nose-bleed seats and he won the lottery...and there have been several others on these message board that have won this time.

    To me, the bigger "shaft" would be if the Ravens just paid lip service to the lottery and were giving all the tickets away to suite holders. They are not...there just aren't that many tickets available.

    I am disappointed I didn't win the lottery, too...but I guess I wasn't really expecting to win it either.
    The Ravens allotment was 12,500 seats. You can immediately take almost 2000 off that number thanks to a 1:1 ration for SUITE holders (not clubs). 119 suites x 15 tickets per suite.

    Now, the stadium has almost 9,000 club seats and over 3000 club seat PSL holders). The lottery is weighted heavily in the club level PSL holders favor. 1:2 is my guess. So that right there knocks out another 3000 SB tickets.. Now your're down to about 8000 seats for "the rest of us". outside of club level you still have over 20,000 PSL holders. No, I didn't stutter. If the Ravens awarded everyone left with SB tickets, they would need almost 50,000 tickets. But you see there are only 8,000 left.. So the Ravens do one more lottery at a 1:5 ratio..

    I don't know if my numbers are exact but they are very close and I do know people who work for the team and this is pretty much how it has been explained to me.




  10. #70

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnBKistler View Post

    You will see just about 1:1 for club seat holders...
    I can assure you that there is no 1:1 ratio for club seat PSL accounts.


    ===========================================================================================================

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    The Superdome seats roughly 72,000 people. Take away 26,000 for each team and you have 46,000 tickets that the public can go buy. I don't know how other teams operate, I would assume it is the same way, but the fact that the Ravens are willing to give a percentage of their tickets to PSL owners is a really nice gesture IMO.
    It will never happen, but I would like to see the Super Bowl rotated between solely 100,000+ seat stadiums - domed or Sunbelt please. Right now that would be Dallas and the Rose Bowl. With the increased ticket capacity going to the fans of the participating teams. An extra 15,000+ seats available to our fans would be great.
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  11. #71

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    Then I would say that those 500 were lucky and I hoped they had a good time! What else can I say?

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the PSL agreement says that as an added bonus they'll be added to a lottery drawing for Super Bowl tix if the situation arises...nothing says that the Ravens HAVE to do that. It is a bonus for being a PSL. And frankly, considering that tickets are going for nearly $3,000 a pop right now, I'd gladly pay the face value of $850 if given the chance.

    Maybe it isn't even a set number? Maybe after the players, front office, coaches, etc all put in how many they want/need, the leftovers get sent out via lottery.

    The Superdome seats roughly 72,000 people. Take away 26,000 for each team and you have 46,000 tickets that the public can go buy. I don't know how other teams operate, I would assume it is the same way, but the fact that the Ravens are willing to give a percentage of their tickets to PSL owners is a really nice gesture IMO.
    Well, you could say the team looked out more for their moneyed bigwigs than the average fan. And by 'you,' I mean anyone, or Manfred Hanover in this instance.

    As I said, I agree, the team can do whatever it wants, including offering no PSL SB lottery (as far as I know there are no league rules that cover this nor do I think there should be), but that doesn't mean every decision is as likely as the next to be criticized.

    And you are right about it probably not being a set number. I have no doubt that if connected people wanted 5,000 seats vs. 4,000, they would get them and everything else adjusted/lowered accordingly. Which again, I think, is Manfred's point about transparency in the process and final numbers.

    In terms of nice gestures, though, each seat can only be bought once for face value. So after that the secondary market determines the price. So, if we assume the team decided not to have any lottery, where would all these 'extra' tickets go? To slightly less-connected cronies? To the secondary market for team profit? To charity? Etc. And obviously, it is a gesture but it is also a business decision, in that the more perks that come with PSL/club/suite ownership the more demand there is for them, and the more financially secure the team is, so it isn't mere charity to the fans.

    Bottomline for me, is that I absolutely agree with everything you say, but I also understand why Manfred wants to know the details of the process so he is better able to gauge exactly how generous the 'gesture' or 'perk' actually is. I also understand why the Ravens would not want (and clearly they are not obligated) to get into the details, because I expect people would recognize that the 1%ers (lol) get taken care of at the expense of the 99%ers (which I have no problem with, check the Politics forum for proof, but obviously some people do/would).




  12. #72

    Re: Ravens Money Grab - Shafts PSL Holders

    I enjoyed the thought that I had a chance to get the tickets for face value. Can't afford the $2k+ aftermarket price along with the long trip for me and the wife. Better then having no chance at all.




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