Ozzie on Cam's firing

**pslholder96** · 01-25-2013, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by Boulderraven

Nobody outside the organization really knows the truth. Why make a statement to undermine Harbaughs authority? Just typical GM speak.

Kind of hard when there were well over 100+ media members today at the castle. He's going to be asked that question again next week too.

**GOTA** · 01-25-2013, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by JoeCool5

This puts a damper on TL's theory that Stevie B. put Harbs on a "hot seat" by influencing Cam's firing.

It does if you believe Ozzie. There are a lot reasons though why Ozzie would say this.

**StingerNLG** · 01-25-2013, 05:56 PM

Why can't we just believe Ozzie on this one? Bisciotti had no problem letting the world know he put Billick in his place. Perhaps after that argument on the sideline between Harbaugh and Cameron was the trigger.

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**RavensRule21215** · 01-25-2013, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

Why can't we just believe Ozzie on this one? Bisciotti had no problem letting the world know he put Billick in his place. Perhaps after that argument on the sideline between Harbaugh and Cameron was the trigger.

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Well, for one thing, most fans have been conditioned to accept that most pressers are full of BS, so there's a tendency to just assume that's the case here. Personally, I could not care less. The main thing was that Cameron needed to go; and he went. That's the only thing that matters to me. The rest...who knows, and who cares?

**leachisabeast** · 01-25-2013, 06:06 PM

Ozzie is the best GM in the league along with Jerry Reese, that is for sure.

**Flacco2Boldin** · 01-25-2013, 06:54 PM

Steve B. put Cam on the hot seat last year. I think Caldwell was brought in as a motivator for Cam. Cam started well enough, but couldn't keep it up. I think securing a playoff berth when they did was key in allowing the in season change. I'm sure like most businesses, there were discussions and meetings about it, and the losing skid, securing a berth, and still having a few games to try something else, lead to agreement on Cam being dismissed. More of the magic of this season.

**Baltimoreboy** · 01-25-2013, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

Lmao, we need to get a gif of when Ozzie starts to repeat "no no no no no".

**Haloti92** · 01-25-2013, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by Baltimoreboy

Awesome.

**RavensDomination** · 01-25-2013, 07:20 PM

Hey Oz, is Matt Ryan better than Joe Flacco?

Originally Posted by Baltimoreboy

**TL24x7** · 01-26-2013, 06:44 AM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

Why can't we just believe Ozzie on this one? Bisciotti had no problem letting the world know he put Billick in his place. Perhaps after that argument on the sideline between Harbaugh and Cameron was the trigger.

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At this point how it happened doesn't matter so why not just go with the party line (as Ozzie did) and move on since things are going well. That said, Bisciotti is more involved than you think.

Just a small case in point... He shared with us back in November that after Webb went down the Ravens were considering a small trade for a corner that would include a conditional seventh round pick. Bisciotti talked Ozzie out of the deal.

So if Steve B is involved in a deal like that, you know that he was involved in the Cameron firing. And from what I've been told it was forced upon Harbs by Bisciotti. The man understands the ebbs and flows of personnel...that's why he can claim to be a self-made billionaire.

And clearly it was the right call!

**sandiegosean** · 01-26-2013, 07:02 AM

From what i've een told it was all Harbs, wat's so hard to believe about that, if you know anything about Harbs. You cant have an owner undrminning your staff, or we have Snyder two here, and i dont believe that. JMHO, from people around.

**The Excellector** · 01-26-2013, 07:32 AM

From what I hear, Cass said it was Harbaugh. He mentioned a particular game and said that after that game, Harbaugh came to the front office and said that it was time for a change.

If you combine that with how well Joe and John seem to be getting along, along with how much they seem to be on the same page these days, ................I'm just saying.

**HoustonRaven** · 01-26-2013, 08:02 AM

I think it's fairly obvious Ozzie is providing some cover for Harbs here.

And there's nothing wrong with that. It's the business side of football and to be expected. I don't know why some view the possibility of Bisciotti putting heat in Harbs to get rid of Cam as a bad thing. It's not a knock on Harbs and it shows the fundamentally, the owners knows what he's doing.

I've had to shit can employees who worked under me at the behest of upper level management and it sucks. But in the end, it was done with my success in mind as well as the organizations continued success.

In the end, it shows they have faith in Harbs and didn't want him clinging to Cam to be his downfall.

**Bigfish** · 01-26-2013, 09:18 AM

Cam's own comments on his firing are interesting. I think most of us agree with him.

Cam Cameron says the Baltimore Ravens' decision to fire him as offensive coordinator was just what the team needed.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/2012...brilliant-move

**TL24x7** · 01-26-2013, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by sandiegosean

From what i've een told it was all Harbs, wat's so hard to believe about that, if you know anything about Harbs. You cant have an owner undrminning your staff, or we have Snyder two here, and i dont believe that. JMHO, from people around.

Because Bisciotti was involved doesn't make him Dan Snyder. He's a smart guy who understands the dynamics of organizational hierarchy perhaps more so than any other owner on the planet given the way he's made his fortune. I think he knows when to call in a marker, and he did.

Each time I've had the pleasure to spend some time with Bisciotti, the way he processes information and the interesting way he responds to questions screams "outside the box" thinking. I learn something from him with each conversation.

But back on point, he made if very clear to me when he said, "I'm more involved than people think."

He isn't dictating decisions, just influencing them by challenging his people and then asking them to consider alternatives and possibilities. The best way to get people to buy in to change is to have them put their own stamp on it. He's a master of that.

That said, his influence in Cam's firing was extreme. He wanted him gone 2 years prior but Harbs convinced him otherwise. In December, Harbs still not buying into Cam's dismissal, ran out of rope and couldn't save him.

You speak of knowing a few things about Harbs. Then you should know he's conservative by nature and firing a family friend, his coordinator in season while in first place, goes completely against his tendencies.

**alienrace** · 01-26-2013, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by TL24x7

I stand by my assertion that Bisciotti HEAVILY influenced the move. That said, it worked and Harbs obviously is no longer on the hot seat.

There is no way Harbs is on the hot seat or ever was. No chance whatsoever.

As for Cam, maybe Biscotti wasn't happy with Cam, that I can buy, but to say he pressured Harbaugh is hard to believe. I don't doubt that he and Harbs discussed the matter, but I don't think it got to the point of saying fire the guy or else.

Especially because all of the counts appear backed up by multiple sources, as well as the game film. Cam and Harbs got into it bigtime on the sideline of the Redskins game, we all saw it and heard about it. Multiple reports said it carried over into the locker room. The reason for the fight was because Harbs asked Cam to use more max-protect in the second half when the Redskins started bringing 5 pass rushers, and Cam didn't listen to him and did his own thing, costing us two turnovers.

It's pretty obvious to everyone that Harbaugh was pissed at Cam for being insubordinate, and went to Biscotti.

**Ravenswintitle** · 01-26-2013, 09:32 AM

just my $.02 but I agree with alien^. Harbs was never on the hot seat and the decision was his. Did he have discussions with management and Biscotti? Likely he did but you have to let the head coach make those decisions or how could you ever hold him accountable? Either way it worked out well for all involved... so far

**Terpsfan82** · 01-26-2013, 10:21 AM

Originally Posted by TL24x7

Because Bisciotti was involved doesn't make him Dan Snyder. He's a smart guy who understands the dynamics of organizational hierarchy perhaps more so than any other owner on the planet given the way he's made his fortune. I think he knows when to call in a marker, and he did.

Each time I've had the pleasure to spend some time with Bisciotti, the way he processes information and the interesting way he responds to questions screams "outside the box" thinking. I learn something from him with each conversation.

But back on point, he made if very clear to me when he said, "I'm more involved than people think."

He isn't dictating decisions, just influencing them by challenging his people and then asking them to consider alternatives and possibilities. The best way to get people to buy in to change is to have them put their own stamp on it. He's a master of that.

That said, his influence in Cam's firing was extreme. He wanted him gone 2 years prior but Harbs convinced him otherwise. In December, Harbs still not buying into Cam's dismissal, ran out of rope and couldn't save him.

You speak of knowing a few things about Harbs. Then you should know he's conservative by nature and firing a family friend, his coordinator in season while in first place, goes completely against his tendencies.

I agree with this and believe it's spot on. We all remember the year end presser after the 2010 season where Harbaugh proclaimed "Cam under fire" would be a good thing. It seemed he was uncomfortable with calling out his friend even then, and was only doing it at the behest of Biscotti. Biscotti was livid at the showing of the offense (126 total yards, meltdown during the second half, going into turtle mode) during that meltdown in Pittsburgh.

**HoustonRaven** · 01-26-2013, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by alienrace

There is no way Harbs is on the hot seat or ever was. No chance whatsoever.

As for Cam, maybe Biscotti wasn't happy with Cam, that I can buy, but to say he pressured Harbaugh is hard to believe. I don't doubt that he and Harbs discussed the matter, but I don't think it got to the point of saying fire the guy or else.

Especially because all of the counts appear backed up by multiple sources, as well as the game film. Cam and Harbs got into it bigtime on the sideline of the Redskins game, we all saw it and heard about it. Multiple reports said it carried over into the locker room. The reason for the fight was because Harbs asked Cam to use more max-protect in the second half when the Redskins started bringing 5 pass rushers, and Cam didn't listen to him and did his own thing, costing us two turnovers.

It's pretty obvious to everyone that Harbaugh was pissed at Cam for being insubordinate, and went to Biscotti.

I think this post is rather naive.

It was pretty well reported to the contrary. Just because the sideline blow up happened doesn't mean it was all Harbs doing.

In fact, I think it lends itself to the opposite -- Harbs and Cam are friends and knew that any Cam fuck up would lead to him getting the boot, thus his sideline frustration and blow up.

**Boulderraven** · 01-26-2013, 11:25 AM

Not exactly sure how it went down, but I have heard from a reliable source is was a "group decision" dating back to a few weeks to when the Ravens played @ Pittsburgh. They were not happy with Cam's protection package calls in the games after that. Ravens blew lead at home vs Pittsburgh, @ Washington to sacks from the Blind side with empty backfeild sets and no TE help. Then "mysteriously" extra TE used, more RB chipping and a Reid goes to IR and McKinnie surfaces at LT once in "shape" Cameron would NOT take orders from Harbs on protection packages as well as abandoning the "sugar" huddle in which Caldwell and the offense spent the offseason designing. Notice the "sugar huddle on the road in NE gashed the Pats in the 2nd half and they let JOE play football" Cam was up Joe's butt to much and he never could get in rythymn. Ozzie and the FO is totally endorsing Harbs so he has control of lockerroom and doesnt lose respect, but Ravens dont make outlaw decisions they do things in a corporate fashion, but Harbs gets the credit as he should.