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  1. #277

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)



    Flacco can name his price up to whatever the exclusive rights franchise tag is. That's 20 and a little change I believe. He will get whatever he wants up to and including that.

    If the Ravens offer less than that Flacco will never accept. Then they'll need to apply the tag, take the 20m cap hit, and keep him under control for a year. They'll be essentially betting that he won't perform at the level of his past 4 games in 2013. Oh, and by the way, Ozzie will have to totally gut the team to fit under the 2013 cap, and won't be able to sign a single free agent.

    The non-exclusive tag is not an option. There are 10-15 teams in the league that will trip over themselves to give up 2 first rounders for Flacco, and many of them have more than enough cap space to give him what he wants. Then, the Ravens would be in the same problem they're already in: give him what he wants or lose him. They would need to fold again and match the offer.

    So, the bottom line is that the Ravens have to give him whatever he pleases or watch him walk and take the team's playoff chances for the next few years with him. It's very interesting; Ozzie has never been in this position. He's completely powerless and gets to choose taking his medicine now or waiting until the last minute (as usual) and gutting the entire team along the way.

    The FO must absolutely be kicking themselves for not paying Flacco what he wanted last August. Obviously that's outcome bias, but he had them over a barrel then and they chose to bet against him and they lost huge. They won't be able to do that again.




  2. #278

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Is there any way we can at least backload Joe's salary (at least for the first two years) but give him a Ray Rice type signing bonus (obviously a the QB payscale)?

    I'm not very clued-on regarding to how the cap works so please excuse me.
    Self appointed Ravens SuperFan in the southern hemisphere/New Zealand.




  3. #279
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
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    Clayton,NC
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    7,189

    Re: Somebody actually has Ozzie by the balls (Negotiation wise)

    I'd take the top 5 QB's average out their per yer amount and offer him that.

    You could debate whether the other QB's have better weapons or if they make the weapons better. But with looks like a decline on the defensive side of the ball, Joe is going to have to but up better numbers for this team to continue to win. I know his agent is starting at the top and doing what he has to to get his client paid, but Joe should not be paid more than the top, IMO.
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  4. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Agreed .... beat ya to it!
    Ha. I would have, but Tapatalk doesn't do merges.

    Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2




  5. #281
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Scaggsville, MD
    Posts
    713

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Flacco can name his price up to whatever the exclusive rights franchise tag is. That's 20 and a little change I believe. He will get whatever he wants up to and including that.

    If the Ravens offer less than that Flacco will never accept. Then they'll need to apply the tag, take the 20m cap hit, and keep him under control for a year. They'll be essentially betting that he won't perform at the level of his past 4 games in 2013. Oh, and by the way, Ozzie will have to totally gut the team to fit under the 2013 cap, and won't be able to sign a single free agent.

    The non-exclusive tag is not an option. There are 10-15 teams in the league that will trip over themselves to give up 2 first rounders for Flacco, and many of them have more than enough cap space to give him what he wants. Then, the Ravens would be in the same problem they're already in: give him what he wants or lose him. They would need to fold again and match the offer.

    So, the bottom line is that the Ravens have to give him whatever he pleases or watch him walk and take the team's playoff chances for the next few years with him. It's very interesting; Ozzie has never been in this position. He's completely powerless and gets to choose taking his medicine now or waiting until the last minute (as usual) and gutting the entire team along the way.

    The FO must absolutely be kicking themselves for not paying Flacco what he wanted last August. Obviously that's outcome bias, but he had them over a barrel then and they chose to bet against him and they lost huge. They won't be able to do that again.
    This is absolutely right on all counts, except for the last paragraph. I don't think there's a single member of the front office that regrets the decision they made, because if even the tiniest fraction of Joe's playoff success was tied to earning a huge number on his new contract, we needed that tiny fraction. The front office's decisions, including letting Joe play out this year, led to a Super Bowl trophy. Whatever happens to this team as a result, whatever gutting has to occur in order to keep Joe in town for the next 5-7 years... it's all worth it. Never forget that.




  6. #282

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    Flacco can name his price up to whatever the exclusive rights franchise tag is. That's 20 and a little change I believe. He will get whatever he wants up to and including that.

    If the Ravens offer less than that Flacco will never accept. Then they'll need to apply the tag, take the 20m cap hit, and keep him under control for a year. They'll be essentially betting that he won't perform at the level of his past 4 games in 2013. Oh, and by the way, Ozzie will have to totally gut the team to fit under the 2013 cap, and won't be able to sign a single free agent.

    The non-exclusive tag is not an option. There are 10-15 teams in the league that will trip over themselves to give up 2 first rounders for Flacco, and many of them have more than enough cap space to give him what he wants. Then, the Ravens would be in the same problem they're already in: give him what he wants or lose him. They would need to fold again and match the offer.

    So, the bottom line is that the Ravens have to give him whatever he pleases or watch him walk and take the team's playoff chances for the next few years with him. It's very interesting; Ozzie has never been in this position. He's completely powerless and gets to choose taking his medicine now or waiting until the last minute (as usual) and gutting the entire team along the way.

    The FO must absolutely be kicking themselves for not paying Flacco what he wanted last August. Obviously that's outcome bias, but he had them over a barrel then and they chose to bet against him and they lost huge. They won't be able to do that again.
    I disagree a bit about losing the bet "huge." For two reasons.

    One, we have no idea what Flacco wanted back then. The rumor of him rejecting 6 for $96M, means that maybe he was asking for $17-18M per. So if we have to now pay $20M per, the downside was not huge (though not insignificant).

    Two, the only way that $20M becomes a 'given' (i.e. organization 'loses' the bet) is if we win the SB, or at the very least get to the SB, and even here, there is a chance we achieve those things with Flacco not looking so spectacular (pseudo-best of both worlds in terms of results).

    I also don't think allowing another team to sign him and then matching has a massive downside. In fact, I think it would only be around where Joe is currently asking. In other words, while there are some desperate teams out there with plenty of money, the idea one of them offers Joe $22+M per year is nil, imo.

    I think Joe wants to be paid the most of any QB, for symbolic reasons as much as anything. To achieve the ability to claim this one can get creative (with incentives, etc) while somewhat limiting the risk.




  7. #283
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    "Merry old England"
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    9,107
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    4

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Joe Linta kind of backed off the highest paid QB in the league comment, and is looking to match Peytons contract, which isn't so bad.




  8. #284

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Another factor in this is Matt Ryan. Atlanta is going to want to extend Ryan. If that deal gets done before Joe's, you know Joe is getting more than Ryan.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  9. #285

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    I disagree a bit about losing the bet "huge." For two reasons.

    One, we have no idea what Flacco wanted back then. The rumor of him rejecting 6 for $96M, means that maybe he was asking for $17-18M per. So if we have to now pay $20M per, the downside was not huge (though not insignificant).

    Two, the only way that $20M becomes a 'given' (i.e. organization 'loses' the bet) is if we win the SB, or at the very least get to the SB, and even here, there is a chance we achieve those things with Flacco not looking so spectacular (pseudo-best of both worlds in terms of results).

    I also don't think allowing another team to sign him and then matching has a massive downside. In fact, I think it would only be around where Joe is currently asking. In other words, while there are some desperate teams out there with plenty of money, the idea one of them offers Joe $22+M per year is nil, imo.

    I think Joe wants to be paid the most of any QB, for symbolic reasons as much as anything. To achieve the ability to claim this one can get creative (with incentives, etc) while somewhat limiting the risk.
    You make a lot of good points. I don't see the "non exclusive tag and then match whatever offer another team makes" thing working though, because why bother putting the tag on him and imperiling your cap when you know you'll match an offer anyway? Why not just make the offer? That may be begging the question a bit, but Flacco's not going to hide what he wants, presumably.

    I also tend to think Joe will get the biggest contract of any QB (and player) in NFL history. I also hope the FO follows your suggestion of using incentives and other "funny money" to make the contract appear that way on paper without the risk of actually committing the money straight up.




  10. #286

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by The Excellector View Post
    Another factor in this is Matt Ryan. Atlanta is going to want to extend Ryan. If that deal gets done before Joe's, you know Joe is getting more than Ryan.
    Yes, but at this point I don't think there is a person on the planet, including Ryan's agent who does not stipulate that Joe will get more. I think Joe no longer is concerned with Ryan's contract situation. He is asking and will get more than Ryan or the Falcons will agree to. By definition Ryan cannot ask for more than Flacco agrees to, if the Ravens and Joe reach a deal first.




  11. #287

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Quote Originally Posted by bmorecareful View Post
    You make a lot of good points. I don't see the "non exclusive tag and then match whatever offer another team makes" thing working though, because why bother putting the tag on him and imperiling your cap when you know you'll match an offer anyway? Why not just make the offer? That may be begging the question a bit, but Flacco's not going to hide what he wants, presumably.

    I also tend to think Joe will get the biggest contract of any QB (and player) in NFL history. I also hope the FO follows your suggestion of using incentives and other "funny money" to make the contract appear that way on paper without the risk of actually committing the money straight up.

    To answer your first question. You do that because the time is so short before the tag has to be designated; there is only like one month before the decision needs to be made.

    Plus, more importantly, you do that if Joe is asking for more than (or close to) what you think any other team will give him (which is obviously unknown and a bit risky).




  12. #288

    Re: Ongoing Flacco Contract Negotiations (Merged)

    Joe and Bisciotti don't seem to be concerned with it. Joe says he's staying here. Steve says he's staying here. They are leaving this in the hands of Ozzie and Linta.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




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