Ray Lewis PED Allegations (Merged)

[NCRAVEN]

Questions: If the NFL knew about these SWAT allegations since the 2010 season, what have they done to implement testing of this IGF-1 substance? What notice did they give to the players named in that article? Is it true that there is still no testing of this substance? If not, why not?

Ray's state of mind goes into this. Before I crucify the guy, I would like to know whether or not he knew this was a banned substance. Hue Jackson was told to disassociate from SWATs. Was Ray told the same? Was he told it contained a banned substance?

I am not such a fool that I don't think these guys don't take vitamins/supplements, etc., to help their performance. At base, that is what Gatorade is. The real issues are: are they taking substances that give them an unfair advantage? Were those substances banned by the NFL? Did they know those substances are banned?

If the NFL warned Ray and all players about this deer antler potion stuff, and if he still ordered/used it, that would seem to imply he knew it was banned/wrong. If they took no steps and never told him or the NFLPA anything, it is very possible he had no idea what he was taking was banned/wrong, etc. Without more facts, we aren't going to be able to know.

It won't keep him from playing on Sunday, but it certainly closes the door on any possible return (as Ed Reed suggested). And it gives the haters more arrows for their quiver.

I don't think they NFL warned the guys about the deer antler stuff. They've banned IGF-1, which SWAT claims their product has in it.

[admartian]

But you can eat those too.... right?

Nah - it's pretty illegal to eat Hobbits - plus you need a wizard to actually catch one.

Not cheap.

[Hammerhead]

Damn it all to hell. I was pumped to see the team play on Sunday, but now I feel as if the media is squeezing all of the joy out of this Super Bowl with as of yet unproven allegations. If you are going to do this, you better have the goods. You better have everything down dead to rights such that there can be no doubt.

But instead you leave a fanbase hanging out there with a story that can never be fully corroborated and sours everybody on what should be a joyous occasion -- win or lose. Now, they are taking all of the pleasure out of it.

I am not against hearing bad news -- but you better have every t crossed and i dotted before you bring a guy through the mud. And that, they have not done.

Thanks for today, SI, ESPN and PFT. Thanks a whole bunch...

[alienrace]

Stages of grief in full effect right now in this thread .....

I don't see that at all. I see a lot of people pissed off that scumbag is capitalizing on the SuperBowl to peddle his snake oil and dragging Ray's name through the mud.

More people pissed at ESPN and SI for trying to make a mountain out of a molehill than anything.

[esmd]

I think you're getting too emotionally wrapped up in this.

Don't let the BS storm that is media day get you down. It's just a sideshow distraction. The main event starts on Sunday @ around 6:30. The rest is just white noise.

[Shambla]

Here's an article from a year ago of a doctor throwing the BS flag on the deer antler spray: http://thesportdigest.com/2011/02/do...-deer-antlers/.

Basically, yes IGF-1 is a banned substance and yes the deer antler velvet contains IGF-1, but the amount is so minuscule that you would need to take millions of doses to have an effect - your body would naturally create a variance in this hormone greater than what would be show up from this spray. This would explain why several athletes who have admitted to taking the spray haven't failed any tests.

[admartian]

MEh - I've always hated sports media. Bring nothing good (97% of them anyway) to the table.

[Hammerhead]

The Sun just posted an article essentially saying that IGF-1 is not stable enough to be maintained in a deer antler spray without being freeze dried. Therefore, whether Ray knew it or not, it was highly unlikely that he took a banned substance even if he took the deer antler spray.

The article also points out that the NFL does no blood testing -- which is how a positive IGF-1 result would be found. The NFL only tests urine.

Again, this makes me mad that we now have to spend Super Bowl week talking about a story that might have neither legs nor smoke. Thanks again, SI.

[NCRAVEN]

Damn it all to hell. I was pumped to see the team play on Sunday, but now I feel as if the media is squeezing all of the joy out of this Super Bowl with as of yet unproven allegations. If you are going to do this, you better have the goods. You better have everything down dead to rights such that there can be no doubt.

But instead you leave a fanbase hanging out there with a story that can never be fully corroborated and sours everybody on what should be a joyous occasion -- win or lose. Now, they are taking all of the pleasure out of it.

I am not against hearing bad news -- but you better have every t crossed and i dotted before you bring a guy through the mud. And that, they have not done.

Thanks for today, SI, ESPN and PFT. Thanks a whole bunch...

With you a little.

Instead of just sitting back getting ready for the game, now we gotta listen to people speculate about unprovable shit they/we nothing about.

[Ravens44]

I like the deer atler plaid. I wanted the wooley Mammoth hair but it is in such short supply.
But, I must say, there's nothing like bringing in a herd of Scottish deer...

[alienrace]

Wait, so now it turns out that the amount of banned substance isn't even enough to be traceable?

WHAT A FUCKING NON-STORY.

DELETE.

[HoustonRaven]

So now we are mad at the media for doing their job?

Where was this disdain when PFT was running stories ad nauseum about Ben raping someone?

You can't ask for the media to be more involved then get mad at the outcome. There isn't a media outlet on the planet that would have ignored this story, given the controversy surrounding PED's in pro sports.

[mmi16]

They all been drinking too much deer wizz

[dscola31]

12 years ago during Superbowl week, the media united us even more than we already were.

We had a MLB who was grilled about an incident that they knew nothing about.

We had a QB who was thought to be our biggest weakness on a defensive minded team.

We had a rookie running back who was stealing the spotlight from the veteran.

We had a string of improbable victoriesm keyed by a divisional round win against the top seed in the AFC where special teams played a huge role.

A hall of fame safety Who was probably as big a leader as the MLB.

And a TE who made huge plays in the playoffs to put us in this position.

Kinda feels like de ja vu to me.

[outlander512]

Around the Horn guys are speaking on it as its fact, and ripping Ray for not answering questiongs. Kevin Blackinstone was very upset, and said he should not be allowed to work at ESPN becuase he wouldnt answer questions today at he podium. And to the testing.. I was hearing earlier about the blood test, and they dont do blood tests, and they would need a baseline first, to even do an accurate test. But SalPal reported earlier that the NFLPA said the NFL DOES test for the substance that makes reighndeer fly..er...makes you heel faster.

[NCRAVEN]

So now we are mad at the media for doing their job?

Where was this disdain when PFT was running stories ad nauseum about Ben raping someone?

You can't ask for the media to be more involved then get mad at the outcome. There isn't a media outlet on the planet that would have ignored this story, given the controversy surrounding PED's in pro sports.

No.

I am mad that they ran a story, what seems to be prematurely. And to top it off, what the company claims they gave him, we don't know if he took, and if he took it, it is such a small amount it would have little to no affect.

And to top it off, they're reporting it as they do everything - to hype it up and lead people to believe this is the next BALCO scandal and Ray is Barry Bonds, Mark Mcguire and Jose Canseco combined.

[NC Raven]

This just looks like one of those things where people who hate Ray are going to jump on it, the media will use it to get clicks, but in the end, as far as being anything substantial (i.e. -- "Ray cheated", which is what, I assume, SI/ESPN are shooting for here) there's nothing to suggest this stuff actually contained enough (or any) of the banned substance.

It may show that Ray intended to violate the league drug policy.

But then again, given the number of NFL players connected with it -- in a public way -- and the letters from the NFL telling them not to shill for the company (but not, apparently, telling them explicitly NOT to use the spray, unless I missed that part) I'd have to say that the NFL is very clear in what it tells players. If it tells them "don't take this spray" and they do, then clearly they've violated the policy.

IF the NFL only said "don't do ads for this company" - but stopped short of telling them not to use the spray -- then I can only conclude that the NFL did not intend to bar players from using the spray.

Again, the NFL has more lawyers than it can shake a stick at. If they want to get a point across to the players about what to do or not to do, I take it at face value that they've said exactly what they intended to say. So if the NFL didn't tell them not to use the spray, then the NFL didn't view use of the spray as a violation.

If I mischaracerized any of the "evidence" so far, please let me know. But this is what I take from all of the above.

[Ravenswintitle]

listening to ESPN radio he said the exact same thing that I posted. If this stuff worked, there'd be a lot of people drinking it. It doesn't.

[alienrace]

So now we are mad at the media for doing their job?

Where was this disdain when PFT was running stories ad nauseum about Ben raping someone?

You can't ask for the media to be more involved then get mad at the outcome. There isn't a media outlet on the planet that would have ignored this story, given the controversy surrounding PED's in pro sports.

I know you like to play Devil's advocate, but this is a little ridiculous.

People aren't made at the media for doing their job, we are mad at them for running with a story that is fishy, has tons of holes, and they haven't done their research. People here are mad at the media NOT doing their job, and NOT being thorough.

Christ, the extract likely doesn't even contain the substance, regardless of whether Ray used it or not.

[outlander512]

This just looks like one of those things where people who hate Ray are going to jump on it, the media will use it to get clicks, but in the end, as far as being anything substantial (i.e. -- "Ray cheated", which is what, I assume, SI/ESPN are shooting for here) there's nothing to suggest this stuff actually contained enough (or any) of the banned substance.

It may show that Ray intended to violate the league drug policy.

But then again, given the number of NFL players connected with it -- in a public way -- and the letters from the NFL telling them not to shill for the company (but not, apparently, telling them explicitly NOT to use the spray, unless I missed that part) I'd have to say that the NFL is very clear in what it tells players. If it tells them "don't take this spray" and they do, then clearly they've violated the policy.

IF the NFL only said "don't do ads for this company" - but stopped short of telling them not to use the spray -- then I can only conclude that the NFL did not intend to bar players from using the spray.

Again, the NFL has more lawyers than it can shake a stick at. If they want to get a point across to the players about what to do or not to do, I take it at face value that they've said exactly what they intended to say. So if the NFL didn't tell them not to use the spray, then the NFL didn't view use of the spray as a violation.

If I mischaracerized any of the "evidence" so far, please let me know. But this is what I take from all of the above.

Well i would say that its not the NFLs job to tell the players they cant use the spray. I think they went above and beyond just by telling players to not associate with the company. They put out the banned substance list and then its on the player not to put products in their body that contain said substance. But i agree with you in the sense that even if this doesnt contain the banned substance, Ray will still look bad because hes acting like he didnt take it, and he knew it was supposed to contain the banned substance. So it would be hard for him to turn around and say, "yeah, i took it, but I knew it didnt really contain the banned substance, or at least not enough of it to actually do anything". Bottom line, if he drank the antler extract, its going to hurt his legacy, fair or not.