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  1. #157
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    Northern Ireland, UK
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    2,673

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?



    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    The "grapevine" consists of about 715 agents registered with the NFL.

    Please show me an example of the last time agents were complaining so loudly about collusion during free agency.
    He's still regurgitating what he's heard. That's like me telling him I've seen BA get jiggy with a man, then he tweets,m "hearing BA is gay". He is not a source of evidence, I am the source.

    So in this case the agents are the source, ie you've only got one source, not multiple as you've claimed.




  2. #158

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Haloti92 View Post
    Two of the biggest spending teams (Cowboys and Redskins) are temporarily penalized and prevented from entering the fray as much as usual (penalties which the NFLPA inexplicably supported). All facts and possible reasons. Owner collusion? Not a fact, and no evidence thus far; either in terms communication/cooperation between owners, or even as far as anyone can tell, in terms of overall cap spending by clubs.
    Do you know who punished WASH and DAL?

    Do you know why they were punished?

    They were punished because they didn't collude.

    Finally, as to the notion that the NFL approved the various contracts that took excessive advantage of the uncapped year in 2010, it’s critical to consider the broader context. The union already was prepared to pounce on any possible evidence of collusion. If the NFL had decided to reject contracts because teams were taking advantage of rules that the teams had every right to take advantage of, the NFLPA would have sued — and the case would have been bolstered by the fact that, on at least six occasions, the NFL had told the teams not to treat the uncapped year as a salary dump. So the NFL approved the contracts and delayed punishment until a point where the league had leverage to persuade the union to agree to an effort to take action after the fact against teams that refused to collude.
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...cap-sanctions/




  3. #159

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    I have been away from the board for a few days, but I got quite a laugh in on this one.

    1 Completely deluional poster vs The entire Logical world.
    Priceless.

    Here you go, here is a simple one for you,. Compare Ellerbe's contract to teh contracts received by David Hawethorne, Curtis Lofton and Stephen Tulloch. Few, if any, people would explain that Ellerbe is the best of the bunch, but he got paid the most BY A LOT. WHY?
    SUPPLY
    and
    DEMAND.
    Last year the market was flooded with MLB'ers and few jobs available. This year, quite the opposite, Ellerbe was CLEARLYthe best aailabel young option, and and more then a few teams interested.




  4. #160

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    You don't know what parameters the NFLPA is using when generating their list. And I never said the NFLPA was a good union anyway. In fact, they are quite shitty in comparison to other sports unions.
    If it's not current data, it's worthless.


    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    I don't know the offers because I am not an agent. And I am not a beat reporter with inside contacts. All I can see are the deals that have been signed. And to me it seems there are a plethora of 1 year, low $$ contracts.
    Great. Cite a 1/$2 signed by a current All Pro. Absent that, can you even name one current All Pro who isn't signed and isn't expected to get a good offer? You brought it up; now (for once) you need to back it up.
    I've upped my standards. Up yours.




  5. #161

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by arnie_uk View Post
    He's still regurgitating what he's heard. That's like me telling him I've seen BA get jiggy with a man, then he tweets,m "hearing BA is gay". He is not a source of evidence, I am the source.

    So in this case the agents are the source, ie you've only got one source, not multiple as you've claimed.
    There are only two sources anyway.

    Owners.

    NFLPA (which includes the agents they register)

    By the very nature of the business you have a 2 party system. Who else is supposed to give information about the private negotiations between the 2 parties? The fly on the wall?




  6. #162
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Clayton,NC
    Posts
    7,317

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Actually I see a bunch of people that have no fucking clue about antitrust regulations.

    Someone here please answer the following:

    1) Are the 32 NFL teams viewed as 1 entity, or 32 separate entities?
    2) How does the answer to 1) impact application of section 1 of the Sherman Act with regards to the market for player contracts and potential collusion?
    Answer this question. What does any of this have to do with what your "evidence"?
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  7. #163

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by moose10101 View Post
    Great. Cite a 1/$2 signed by a current All Pro. Absent that, can you even name one current All Pro who isn't signed and isn't expected to get a good offer? You brought it up; now (for once) you need to back it up.
    Huff was All Pro 2010. As was John Abraham (currently unsigned).

    Nothing I say will convince you anyway.




  8. #164
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Northern Ireland, UK
    Posts
    2,673

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    There are only two sources anyway.

    Owners.

    NFLPA (which includes the agents they register)

    By the very nature of the business you have a 2 party system. Who else is supposed to give information about the private negotiations between the 2 parties? The fly on the wall?
    So if there is only two sources why do you keep bringing up Aaron wilson, which a number if people have admitted is the reason they jumped into the conversation?




  9. #165

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Huff was All Pro 2010. As was John Abraham (currently unsigned).

    Nothing I say will convince you anyway.
    Abraham is a hundred years old, and Huff plays one of the lowest valued positions on a football field, DIDN"T EVEN PLAY THAT POSITION LAST YEAR, and th only reported suitor not Baltimore had 50k in slaary cap space.




  10. #166

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Do you know who punished WASH and DAL?

    Do you know why they were punished?

    They were punished because they didn't collude.


    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...cap-sanctions/
    I am aware of the issue. I was one of the few posters that defended those two teams' positions and stated that the unwritten "agreement" that they apparently 'violated' was indeed collusion. Check the forum archives.

    But this has nothing to do with my point on the current issue, which was:

    a) these two teams are currently out of the FA market and they are notoriously known as upward drivers to salaries and contracts, and

    b) the NFLPA signed on to the penalties, leaving the Cowboys and Redskins without any real recourse in terms of defending themselves (everyone but them were on the other side).




  11. #167
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Northern Ireland, UK
    Posts
    2,673

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by bt12483 View Post
    Huff was All Pro 2010. As was John Abraham (currently unsigned).

    Nothing I say will convince you anyway.
    You seem to ignore, younger free agents like Kruger and ellerbe got paid above what they should, so to counter the overpayment, obviously others are going to get paid less than they expect.




  12. #168

    Re: Player collusion in Seattle?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    I have been away from the board for a few days, but I got quite a laugh in on this one.

    1 Completely deluional poster vs The entire Logical world.
    Yes. If I am delusional than so it Tony Agnone. So are all the agents feeding info to Aaron Wilson. So are all of the agents complaining to the NFLPA.

    Priceless.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Here you go, here is a simple one for you,. Compare Ellerbe's contract to teh contracts received by David Hawethorne, Curtis Lofton and Stephen Tulloch. Few, if any, people would explain that Ellerbe is the best of the bunch, but he got paid the most BY A LOT. WHY?
    SUPPLY
    and
    DEMAND.
    Last year the market was flooded with MLB'ers and few jobs available. This year, quite the opposite, Ellerbe was CLEARLYthe best aailabel young option, and and more then a few teams interested.
    1) Stars will always get paid. But what if you are not a star? You have to also look at the aggregate.

    And you have to look at why Miami is overpaying.

    1) They want stadium funding
    2) Ireland is in a contract year (hot seat)

    Gee did you notice that Miami also introduced a new logo? There are making a concerted effort to get fans to come to Dolphins games to get more tax money for the stadium.




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