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  1. #49

    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?



    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    I think some members on this board are drastically under valuing the additions of Michael Huff and Chris Canty. Time will tell if they will work out here, but I will say this.

    Ngata at NT, and Canty at DE is a HUGE upgrade over having Kemo/Cody starting at NT. The addition of Spears was far from a flashy move, but adding decent depth players to a rotation on the Dline upgrades the overall unit. Of course the addition of Dumervil adds to the strength of the Dline. So overall, ON PAPER, the Dline has been massively upgraded no matter what anyone says, I'm not sure how you can argue with that. The Dline was probably our biggest weakness last season.

    Now onto a more touchy subject. Ed Reed is not the player he used to be, and advanced metrics/film clearly shows that Huff is just at this point a better overall player than Ed Reed, so even though I may get some abuse for this, the FS position was upgraded.

    What was downgraded was ILB and SS. Pollard was a good player, despite being a liability in coverage. Lets wait and see what the Ravens do in the draft to replace Pollard, unless Thompson or Ihedigbo end up starting and surprise us by being good players. ILB is a question mark, Ellerbe is a big loss even if he did get overpaid. We have the potential upside of McClain playing well here, but I think we'll bring in some guys through the draft. Even if Ellerbe was great in limited playing time last season, the overall performance of the ILB corps was below average.
    agreed, all around. I actually think that the defense has improved this offseason. I surely was in teh sky is falling crowd after the moves to get rid of Pollard and Boldin, but Huff, Canty and of course Dumerville have settled me down, quite a LOT. IF this allows us to draft Hopkins in the first, I'll be quite happy with the changes, of course short of getting a LT, but it doesn't appear that was ever the plan. Oher at LT appears to have been the plan all along. Hopefully we at least secure a Brennan Williams/Chris/Faulk David Quessenberry/Luke Marquadt type for that spot down the road. Heck, at the value point those guys are at, it might be smart to grab 2...





  2. #50

    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    I think some members on this board are drastically under valuing the additions of Michael Huff and Chris Canty. Time will tell if they will work out here, but I will say this.

    Ngata at NT, and Canty at DE is a HUGE upgrade over having Kemo/Cody starting at NT. The addition of Spears was far from a flashy move, but adding decent depth players to a rotation on the Dline upgrades the overall unit. Of course the addition of Dumervil adds to the strength of the Dline. So overall, ON PAPER, the Dline has been massively upgraded no matter what anyone says, I'm not sure how you can argue with that. The Dline was probably our biggest weakness last season.

    Now onto a more touchy subject. Ed Reed is not the player he used to be, and advanced metrics/film clearly shows that Huff is just at this point a better overall player than Ed Reed, so even though I may get some abuse for this, the FS position was upgraded.

    What was downgraded was ILB and SS. Pollard was a good player, despite being a liability in coverage. Lets wait and see what the Ravens do in the draft to replace Pollard, unless Thompson or Ihedigbo end up starting and surprise us by being good players. ILB is a question mark, Ellerbe is a big loss even if he did get overpaid. We have the potential upside of McClain playing well here, but I think we'll bring in some guys through the draft. Even if Ellerbe was great in limited playing time last season, the overall performance of the ILB corps was below average.
    I agree with you that FS was an upgrade. I also believe Canty is a big addition to the line. Doom is probably a wash with the Kruger we saw in the playoffs. I do disagree on the downgrade at SS and ILB. I know this is blasphemy on this board but Ray Lewis was horrible when he did play. Yes he was an inspirational leader but he was also a liability on the field. He could not cover and he was bad against the run in his slimmed down version. McClain is an upgrade over Ray Lewis. For starters McClain will allow the coaches to pull him out on obvious passing plays. McClain was better against the run and will be used primarily in that role. Ellerbe is a loss but Ellerbe has barely been able to stay on the field. A healthy Ellerbe for a full season would be great but that is not what we had last year. Pollard was great as a SS in his first year with the Ravens. Last year He was injured against Philly and never really recovered. He was not very good all year. He did have a hand in the playoff win over the Patriots with his hit on Ridley. The off season is not over and the Ravens should be able to easily find the equivalent of what was provided by Pollard last year.

    The guys lost off of the defense last year really did not play all that well. Their may be a veteran leadership loss but this defense has a ton of veteran leadership left. This year's defense also has the benefit of a healthy Ngata, McPhee and Suggs over last year. Williams player fairly well and the development of Smith and the return of Webb should offset his loss.

    Boldin was sure to be gone prior to going beast mode in the playoffs. Keeping Boldin would have meant the rest of the team being weak. I would gladly take Doom, Huff and McClain over Boldin. The Ravens also have cap space to add some important pieces after the draft. That would not have been possible if they had not traded Boldin. Boldin was a middle of the road wr prior to the playoffs. I understand the change in OC may have lead to increased production but the eyes do not deceive. He rarely got open. It may seem like it leaves the Ravens with a big hole but we have no idea what the Ravens and Caldwell see in wrs and TEs already on the roster. After all Boldin was essentially an over glorified TE after Caldwell took over the offense.

    Ravens are in a better spot because they do not have a bunch of over the hill vets coming off the banquet circuit. Nothing motivates the remaining players like trimming the fat. It reminds them that they have to perform or they will be out the door as well.




  3. #51
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    I think some members on this board are drastically under valuing the additions of Michael Huff and Chris Canty. Time will tell if they will work out here, but I will say this.

    Ngata at NT, and Canty at DE is a HUGE upgrade over having Kemo/Cody starting at NT. The addition of Spears was far from a flashy move, but adding decent depth players to a rotation on the Dline upgrades the overall unit. Of course the addition of Dumervil adds to the strength of the Dline. So overall, ON PAPER, the Dline has been massively upgraded no matter what anyone says, I'm not sure how you can argue with that. The Dline was probably our biggest weakness last season.

    Now onto a more touchy subject. Ed Reed is not the player he used to be, and advanced metrics/film clearly shows that Huff is just at this point a better overall player than Ed Reed, so even though I may get some abuse for this, the FS position was upgraded.

    What was downgraded was ILB and SS. Pollard was a good player, despite being a liability in coverage. Lets wait and see what the Ravens do in the draft to replace Pollard, unless Thompson or Ihedigbo end up starting and surprise us by being good players. ILB is a question mark, Ellerbe is a big loss even if he did get overpaid. We have the potential upside of McClain playing well here, but I think we'll bring in some guys through the draft. Even if Ellerbe was great in limited playing time last season, the overall performance of the ILB corps was below average.
    Agree on everything here. I really love what Ozzie has done.

    The 2013 Ravens team should be better. The defense has been vastly improved so far. The d-line went from a liability to a strength now with moving Ngata to NT and the additions of Canty/Spears. Plus, you got Art Jones coming back off a great SB performance who you hope continues to develop and hopefully McPhee will be healthy this year. The outside linebackers with Suggs and Doom is just awesome. Also, I think we'll be fine at inside linebacker with McClain playing the Ellerbe type roll. I think Ozzie will come away with a guy like Arthur Brown who has the speed to play coverage. Finally, with safety Huff is no doubt a much better player than Reed at this point. I love Reed but you know father time always wins and he'll be 35 before the season starts. The strong safety spot is a question mark at this point, but I believe they'll draft one and have a camp competition.




  4. #52

    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    I REALLY like Christian Thompson's ability or potential whichever to play SS to be honest.




  5. #53
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Agreed with all the posts above, and srobert I pretty much agree even with the Ray Lewis bit, I just didn't really want to say it.




  6. #54
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paintballguy View Post
    Agree on everything here. I really love what Ozzie has done.

    The 2013 Ravens team should be better. The defense has been vastly improved so far. The d-line went from a liability to a strength now with moving Ngata to NT and the additions of Canty/Spears. Plus, you got Art Jones coming back off a great SB performance who you hope continues to develop and hopefully McPhee will be healthy this year. The outside linebackers with Suggs and Doom is just awesome. Also, I think we'll be fine at inside linebacker with McClain playing the Ellerbe type roll. I think Ozzie will come away with a guy like Arthur Brown who has the speed to play coverage. Finally, with safety Huff is no doubt a much better player than Reed at this point. I love Reed but you know father time always wins and he'll be 35 before the season starts. The strong safety spot is a question mark at this point, but I believe they'll draft one and have a camp competition.




  7. #55
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Also, how could I forget? We will be getting one of the best CB's in the NFL back in Webb. PFF had Webb graded as one of the best CB's before he went down with his knee injury.




  8. #56

    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Sad to see Boldin go regardless, but the biggest clutch plays of the year were made by other younger players.
    Way Down South in New Orleans




  9. #57
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    My two cents.

    On offense...it is all about LT.
    Whatever the starting Oline is, if they give Joe the same kind of time and open holes like was done in the playoffs, this offense will be one of the finest we have ever seen here in Baltimore.

    On defense...we lost a ton of experience. We have already gained youth, speed, and a stronger front 7.
    We need one more ILB (starting caliber) in the draft and maybe one NG type to rotate with Ngata now, for the future as well.

    Don't forget about Corey Graham who stepped up BIG TIME, especially during the playoffs.
    If Webb is truly back to starting form, here's our top 3 corners: Webb, Graham, and J. Smith.

    So, it is about finding another safety to maybe even start with Huff.
    What will they pick, a FS or a SS or both?
    There are a number of players that could fit right now.

    IMHO, if we pick up guys like Alonso, Shamarko Thomas, and Faulk...maybe Da'Rick Rogers, Frederick at center, this team could have a great younger, faster, talented roster.

    And I agree with everyone that said it will take time for this team to gell, especially on defense.
    That will determine how far they go.




  10. #58
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravens44 View Post
    ... And I agree with everyone that said it will take time for this team to gell, especially on defense...
    I don't exactly agree. While we've lost some significant players (Ray, Reed, Ellerbe, Cary Williams), the Ravens have also acquired veterans (Canty, Spears, Dumerville, R. McClain, and Huff) who can certainly fill in without much loss in production. Add in Webb (coming back from injury), plus 12 draft choices, well I don't think the "D" will skip a beat and will perhaps be better than their 2012 version... Bc




  11. #59
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    There is no such thing as "gelling" in todays NFL, teams lose players everywhere, its the reality of the salary cap. That's what TC, minicamps and pre season games are for.




  12. #60
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    Re: How much worse are Ravens in 2013?

    Quote Originally Posted by leachisabeast View Post
    There is no such thing as "gelling" in todays NFL, teams lose players everywhere, its the reality of the salary cap. That's what TC, minicamps and pre season games are for.
    Sure there is. The Niners are a prime example. They will return many players who have played together for sometime now.
    I do understand where you are coming from though...yes, players move around all the time now.
    I realize it's not going to be like the Steelers in the 70's where they play together for 5-8 years.

    But still, the group of new players and the old players will be learning about each other all season long.
    There is nothing like knowing instinctively what all the players around you are going to do based on having played along side of them over time.
    With Reed, Ray, Sizzle, and Ngata...those guys knew what each other were doing all the time. And when they came to the sideline and communicate or even more importantly on the field between plays or even seconds before the snap, there is an awareness that takes some time.
    It will click faster in December than in September.
    Denver was also a great example last season, when it took around 4 games into the season for the rest of the offense to catch up with Manning and how he ran things with all the audibles, etc.
    And it took some time for him to adjust to them as well, like where exactly to throw the ball to each individual receiver for the best chance of a catch. The suttle things sometimes turn out to be the most important things when everything else is equal, and can be the difference between winning and losing by making that, one more play.




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