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  1. #1

    Landover "Redtails"?



    This is the height of liberal hypocrisy:

    A D.C. Councilmember plans to introduce a resolution that calls on the Washington Redskins to change their name. Council member David Grosso (GRAH'-so), an at-large independent, says the name is "racist and derogatory," and that "it's time to make a change."

    ...... Grosso's resolution suggests "Redtails" as a new nickname. He says it would honor the Tuskegee Airmen and allow the team to maintain its fight song and color scheme with a few minor changes.
    So, if I understand liberal thinking, it is "racist" to use a term that the majority of Indians accept, but Big White Brother in DC finds "offensive" on the Indians' behalf. But changing the name to focus on a group of black pilots who have been made into bigger-than-life heroes by Big White Historical Revisionist Brother in DC -- that's not racist because ....? Huh? Could it be that black racism is acceptable to the Liberals, but racism towards Indians via use of the term "Redskins", which appears to be just a figment of Liberals' imagination?
    In a 2003 BBC poll that asked Brits to name the "Greatest American Ever", Mr. T came in fourth, behind ML King (3rd), Abe Lincoln (2nd) and Homer Simpson (1st).




  2. #2
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    I don't think most blacks, including myself, would find "Redtails" racist.

    There is no need to change the name. Only a small miniority of native americans have ever made any issue of it. Besides the name Redskins had almost nothing to do with indians, but to honor the Boston Tea Party.
    "I got this." - Justin Tucker




  3. #3
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    Not sure why this is a "liberal" issue, considering that Pols from both sides of the fence have been clambering for a name change for years ....

    I've never understood why this vocal minority of people who want a name change get so much publicity. WaPo did a story a few years back, and its literally only one group that's spawning all of this.

    This is about PC nonsense, not race or discrimination.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  4. #4
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    This may not have been a big deal for most cities, but DC is a pretty liberal city. I suspect that is why there is a lot of hooplah about this.




  5. #5
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Not sure why this is a "liberal" issue, considering that Pols from both sides of the fence have been clambering for a name change for years ....

    I've never understood why this vocal minority of people who want a name change get so much publicity. WaPo did a story a few years back, and its literally only one group that's spawning all of this.

    This is about PC nonsense, not race or discrimination.
    Not according to native Americans. They're the ones who have been trying to change the
    name for years. They got a high school to change its name. They always sue the
    Washington Redskins, not the Atlanta Braves or Chicago Blackhawks or cities and states named Indianapolis, Indiana.

    The original name was the Boston Braves up in Massachusetts in 1932 and George
    Preston Marshall was the owner that changed the name and he was infamous
    for being a racist.

    The following year he moved to Fenway Park home of the Red Sox and re-named
    the team to Redskins. They moved to DC in 1937. Today they're the second wealthiest
    NFL team worth about $1.55B according to Forbes.

    College football was king in 1932 and Marshall incorporated many of its popular
    gimmicks like half time shows and he had the first marching band and fight song
    called HAIL TO THE CHIEFS but he was
    so racist he refused to sign minority players while the Colts, Browns and Packers
    did and beat the shit out of him. He even traded the rights to Ernie Davis the great
    RB from Syracuse to the Browns because he was black but Davis died of leukemia
    before he ever played.

    Marshall also claimed Bmore as his property and kept us from getting a team.
    Sound familiar? When we finally got the Colts he got a $100,000 infringement
    fee from the city and that was a lot of money back in the late 40s and early 50s.


    The Bullets changed their name because of PC with so many getting killed by them
    when DC became the murder capital of the country but the name Redskins is very
    offensive to native Americans.

    There's also military helicopters named Apache and Blackhawk in honor of those native Americans. In fact, the Caribbean got its name from an indian tribe named the
    Caribbe-sp in Puerto Rico that fought Ponce De Leon when he discovered the island. They were the most fierce tribe he fought and honored them naming the famous sea after them.

    The Skins always claimed their name was in honor of millions of fans around the world
    but Marshall was definitely a racist and was thinking of the old cowboys days in the west
    when they called them that and killed them.
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-07-2013 at 09:21 PM.
    UBER RAVENS FAN AND HISTORIAN GURU.




  6. #6

    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dade View Post
    There is no need to change the name. Only a small miniority of native americans have ever made any issue of it.
    I tend to like your comments on here, Dade ... not just because we both lend toward the liberal/Democrat side (or at least it appears that way), but because you tend to be very reasoned in your arguments. However, on this occasion I must ask ...

    1) Does an issue become obsolete just because "a small minority" cares about it? (The USA was actually founded on principles that protect the minority from the majority.)

    2) Does an issue become morally irrelevant just because "a small minority" cares about it? Or, in other words, if I believe use of the term "Redskins" is wrong (which I do), should I stop fighting for change (change I believe is for the good) just because it's not a popular opinion?

    3) I also find it hard to believe that only "a small minority" of Native Americans do not like being called "redskins." I went to Dartmouth for undergrad, which has a strong and vibrant Native American community (and a touchy Native American history, much like the U.S.) Never in my wildest dreams would I think it was OK to call one of my Native American friends a "redskin." But I could be convinced of this "small minority" you claim if pointed in the right direction with links, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dade View Post
    Besides the name Redskins had almost nothing to do with indians, but to honor the Boston Tea Party.
    Also just wanted to say I had never heard of this before but that's interesting. Link?
    Thoughts on Ray Rice: http://brafootball.wordpress.com/




  7. #7

    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    Quote Originally Posted by AirFlacco View Post
    The Skins always claimed their name was in honor of millions of fans around the world
    but Marshall was definitely a racist and was thinking of the old cowboys days in the west
    when they called them that and killed them.
    Great post AirFlacco, thanks for a lot of information I didn't know.

    I too have found it very odd that the team is always on the kick that the name "honors" Native Americans. Excuse me? By using a name that was tossed around by bigots and their oppressors (sorry for the dramatic language, but it's true)?

    To quote Eric Cartman, "You can say it until your ass bleeds, but that doesn't make it true."
    Thoughts on Ray Rice: http://brafootball.wordpress.com/




  8. #8
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    As a Ravens fan, I don't really care one way or the other if the name stays or goes.

    But a simple check online with snopes and other sites shows the history of the word (that it's origins do start with the name honoring native Americans) and that the "outrage" is recent phenomenon, from a very small group of people and their are numerous Native American tribes that are either indifferent or support the use of the name.

    From the outside looking in, looks to me like a bunch of not so well intended and intrusive do-gooders creating a controvery then jockeying to be the saviors.

    I cannot stand Maryland's quaint, alternative little football team as much as the next Ravens fan. But I hope Snyder holds fast on this one.
    Last edited by HoustonRaven; 05-18-2013 at 05:54 PM.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  9. #9
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    I hope you keep posting here, aka.

    We need some balance to this area of the boards and hopefully you'll provide some spirited and respectful debate from your side of the political fence.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  10. #10
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    Quote Originally Posted by akashicrecorder View Post
    I tend to like your comments on here, Dade ... not just because we both lend toward the liberal/Democrat side (or at least it appears that way), but because you tend to be very reasoned in your arguments. However, on this occasion I must ask ...

    1) Does an issue become obsolete just because "a small minority" cares about it? (The USA was actually founded on principles that protect the minority from the majority.)

    2) Does an issue become morally irrelevant just because "a small minority" cares about it? Or, in other words, if I believe use of the term "Redskins" is wrong (which I do), should I stop fighting for change (change I believe is for the good) just because it's not a popular opinion?

    3) I also find it hard to believe that only "a small minority" of Native Americans do not like being called "redskins." I went to Dartmouth for undergrad, which has a strong and vibrant Native American community (and a touchy Native American history, much like the U.S.) Never in my wildest dreams would I think it was OK to call one of my Native American friends a "redskin." But I could be convinced of this "small minority" you claim if pointed in the right direction with links, etc.
    Good point ak, and your right. Just because a group is in the minoirity doesn't mean they're not right. Often times it is those in minoirities that bring about the right and just changes.

    Personally I don't think the name should be change.

    Quote Originally Posted by akashicrecorder View Post
    Also just wanted to say I had never heard of this before but that's interesting. Link?
    I had read a few years ago that the name was changed to Redskins in '33 in part to honor the Boston Tea Party. Because Sam Adams and the rest dressed as Native Americans when they dumped the tea in the harbor. Can't seem to find it now. I'll keep looking. There is also a rumor that the name was to honor coach Lone Star Dietz, who was part Sioux.

    BTW thanks for the compliment, hope you continue to post in this forum ak. It can be a little one sided around here at times.
    "I got this." - Justin Tucker




  11. #11
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    I have argued vehemently that FSU is under no obligation to change their name as they have the full support of the local Seminole peoples and use the name respectfully and without the racially insensitive imagery that teams like the Cleveland Indians do.

    And while I can acknowledge that the Skins mascot is racially respectful, I agree with others who point out that the term redskin is not. Perhaps a compromise would be to adopt FSU's approach and honor a specific local Native American tribe. I confess I'm a bit ignorant as to the local tribes, but perhaps a more knowledgable poster could fill us in on which nations originated in the DC, Md, NoVa area.
    My motto was always to keep swinging. Whether I was in a slump or feeling badly or having trouble off the field, the only thing to do was keep swinging. -Hank Aaron




  12. #12
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    Re: Landover "Redtails"?

    The Piscataway Indians ruled Southern Maryland and were discovered by Capt John
    Smith. They originally called the Potamac River river of geese and that name reflects
    their original name albeit several spelling changes later.

    The Susqehanna indians ruled most of Maryland or northern MD as the famous river is named after them. The state of Delaware is named after the Delaware indians from there.

    However, indians were harsh on each other. The Blackhawks came all the way down from
    up Canada to here and fought those tribes. Then enslaved the Delwares and the
    Susquehanas ran off. They ruled the territory up here in Harford County.

    The tribe mentioned in Kevin Costner's movie DANCES WITH WOLVES was one of the most fierce tribes out west but that movie showed how hard they were treated by rival tribes. Women were raped and enslaved by other tribes and sold to other tribes.

    The Boston Braves might well have been named in honor of the Boston Tea Party. That was the original name of the Skins as posted above when it was definitely racist when Marshall
    changed to Redskins. On second thought, the colonists masqueraded as indians so the king would blame them not the merchants who did the dirty deed and while the word terrorist wasnt used in those days, they would have been considered terrorists by today's standards.

    Just a thought.

    GENERAL SHERMAN SAID JUST KILL THE REST OF THE INDIANS AND BE DONE WITH THEM.
    Last edited by AirFlacco; 05-19-2013 at 08:41 AM.
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