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  1. #49
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving



    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Because he believes it
    That doesn't really answer the question. If he was never an off the filed leader then he should have said:

    We talk about the transition of losing so many guys, a guy like myself and Ed Reed and other guys that are based off leadership, I've said it earlier: ‘Where would the leadership come from?'Because the leadership being strong in the locker room and winning games, listen talent sometimes can win you games. But when you talk about what's going on off the field, that's the most important place where leadership steps up.
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  2. #50

    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    McKinney is 34 and Jones is 29, this incident is owned by them and only them. I'm sure they've heard all the right things at some point in the course of their lives. Ray is entitled to his opinion and I have and always will have the upmost respect for him. My opinion is it's on them, they were not victims of insufficient leadership. They did not exercise "due care" in keeping themselves from gaining bad press and a bottle to the skull.
    : Due care: the care that an ordinarily reasonable and prudent person exercises under all circumstances for his own protection


    Now I'm going to hide.




  3. #51
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    That doesn't really answer the question. If he was never an off the filed leader then he should have said:
    It's not an answer that pleases you, but it completely answers the question as best as it can be, given the impossible nature of the question.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  4. #52

    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    It is not a lack of leadership that caused this incident. It is a momentary, or several moments of lack of self control on at least 2 peoples (who are adults) part. I think Ray is wrong, but it doesn't change the fact that Preston (and several posters on this board, too) has an agenda when it comes to Ray, and it probably stems from Rays faith and his(their) lack there of and disdain for those that have faith.




  5. #53
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Ray Lewis can say whatever the fuck he wants for two reasons:

    1) He is the best player the Ravens have ever had and likely ever will.

    2) He isn't a Raven anymore.

    He isn't shitting on anyone. He is just saying that leadership may have prevented this and while that is true, it may not have. Leadership didn't help keep David Reed focused before he got busted for weed. Leadership didn't help Donte Stallworth out when he drank and drove. Leadership didn't help when Albert McClellan allegedly beat up his girlfriend/fiancÚ/whatever.

    Jacoby and McKinnie were out getting fucked up with hookers/strippers in DC at 3 in the morning. They are grown ass men and that was their decision.
    Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer.

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  6. #54

    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    And how is he off base?
    1) Maybe you had forgotten, but Ray Lewis had a bit of a history of nightclub problems of his own. Nearly cost him his NFL career, and his freedom.

    2) Ray Lewis had a number of other personal failings that manifest themselves in things like 6 confirmed illegitimate children with 4 different women (and likely several more),

    3) Ray decided after his near-prison experience, to re-make his image. He did so quite successfully, by devoting himself to being a student of the game, and to physical conditioning.

    4) After a decade or so of this, he developed a reputation as a leader (and deservedly so).

    5) After being told by friends, press, fans, and hangers-on for so long what a wonderful leader he was, and how important he was to the soul of the Ravens, I think perhaps Mr. Lewis began to think of himself as a little more than maybe he really was.

    6) This is (IMHO) the point at which Ray began the theatrical interviews, and the hyper-emotional speeches, and the like. I think his ego has outpaced his person for the last 5 years or so. I think because he was so well loved in this town, his views on his own importance were reinforced to the point of self-delusion.

    Ray Lewis was a helluva football player. Probably the best MLB to ever play the game... but he was not a shining example of manhood. Particularly in his youth. He transcended his own off-field troubles with hard work and discipline. Good for him.

    But for him to suggest that the absence of his leadership was a contributing factor to whatever shenanigans McKinney and Jones got into is beyond self-serving. It is self-delusion.




  7. #55
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    1) Maybe you had forgotten, but Ray Lewis had a bit of a history of nightclub problems of his own. Nearly cost him his NFL career, and his freedom.

    2) Ray Lewis had a number of other personal failings that manifest themselves in things like 6 confirmed illegitimate children with 4 different women (and likely several more),

    3) Ray decided after his near-prison experience, to re-make his image. He did so quite successfully, by devoting himself to being a student of the game, and to physical conditioning.

    4) After a decade or so of this, he developed a reputation as a leader (and deservedly so).

    5) After being told by friends, press, fans, and hangers-on for so long what a wonderful leader he was, and how important he was to the soul of the Ravens, I think perhaps Mr. Lewis began to think of himself as a little more than maybe he really was.

    6) This is (IMHO) the point at which Ray began the theatrical interviews, and the hyper-emotional speeches, and the like. I think his ego has outpaced his person for the last 5 years or so. I think because he was so well loved in this town, his views on his own importance were reinforced to the point of self-delusion.

    Ray Lewis was a helluva football player. Probably the best MLB to ever play the game... but he was not a shining example of manhood. Particularly in his youth. He transcended his own off-field troubles with hard work and discipline. Good for him.

    But for him to suggest that the absence of his leadership was a contributing factor to whatever shenanigans McKinney and Jones got into is beyond self-serving. It is self-delusion.
    Wow.

    His past troubles put him in a perfect position to speak on leadership or a lack thereof.

    And I've yet to hear ANY sound reasoning that his opinion on the matter is self serving, especially considering if you asked 100 Ravens fans a year ago who the leader of this team is, 100 of them would say Ray.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  8. #56

    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Wow.

    And I've yet to hear ANY sound reasoning that his opinion on the matter is self serving,.


    Seriously?

    The man said that it is the lack of leadership in the franchise (which is now absent because he and Ed moved on) that is the cause of incidents like this one....

    And you don't see that as self-serving? Seriously?




  9. #57
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    World Domination 3 Points at a Time!




  10. #58
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Seriously?

    The man said that it is the lack of leadership in the franchise (which is now absent because he and Ed moved on) that is the cause of incidents like this one....

    And you don't see that as self-serving? Seriously?
    On it's face, no. Because there's reasons (many of them) that he may be right.

    And the greater point is nobody knows nuttin'. He could be wrong just as easily as he can be dead on right with his analysis, yet people who are fans of his just a few short months ago for some reason now refuse to give him the benefit of the doubt.

    But for the sake of argument, lets say this is a self-serving move on his part. How does that automatically make him wrong?

    I do give Preston credit though. He knows EXACTLY how to get folks to click on his shit.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  11. #59

    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post

    But for the sake of argument, lets say this is a self-serving move on his part. How does that automatically make him wrong?
    Others have already said it... but I'll try to give a few examples.

    You are suggesting that we should believe that McKinney's behavior was held in check by Lewis' leadership.... And that because Ray was here, McKinney devoted himself to the game, quit blowing his money on hookers and parties... stopped jamming cheeseburgers into his pie-hole... showed up for camp on time... and at weight...?

    And only after Ray left (taking his trademarked leadership with him) did McKinney relapse into hookers, cheeseburgers, tardiness, and fat-pants?

    That doesn't sound right... does it?

    Maybe some men do what they do in spite of the "leadership" provided by others... maybe Jacoby is always putting himself in these situations... hell we KNOW McKinney is... Maybe the only difference between this event.. and dozens of other McKinney parties here and in Florida, is that this one happened to make the papers. (unlike the ones that certainly happened when Ray was here)




  12. #60
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    Re: Mike Preston: Ray Lewis needs to stop being so self-serving

    owknows, you didn't answer my question, but for the sake of keeping the conversation going ....

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Others have already said it... but I'll try to give a few examples.

    You are suggesting that we should believe that McKinney's behavior was held in check by Lewis' leadership
    No, I am not saying that all. I've never said that.

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    .... And that because Ray was here, McKinney devoted himself to the game, quit blowing his money on hookers and parties... stopped jamming cheeseburgers into his pie-hole...showed up for camp on time... and at weight...?
    Nope. Never said that either.

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    And only after Ray left (taking his trademarked leadership with him) did McKinney relapse into hookers, cheeseburgers, tardiness, and fat-pants?

    That doesn't sound right... does it?
    Wrong a third time. Never made that claim either.

    Quote Originally Posted by owknows View Post
    Maybe some men do what they do in spite of the "leadership" provided by others... maybe Jacoby is always putting himself in these situations... hell we KNOW McKinney is... Maybe the only difference between this event.. and dozens of other McKinney parties here and in Florida, is that this one happened to make the papers. (unlike the ones that certainly happened when Ray was here)
    THAT I agree with. There's one not-so-small difference in all of this and that's a team member got hit upside the head with a bottle.

    Ever hold a champagne bottle? It's damn heavy and this incident is an inch or two away from being something much worse than it was.

    As an organization, you don't simply throw your hands in the air and say "Gee, that was a close one. Lets leave it alone going forward". No, you treat it like it is.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




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