Impressive?

[FHRaven]

Most all the time Boller throws exactly to the reciever he's watching as the play develops. You' are correct, I or no one else can make any definitive claims on what would have happened had Boller not been hit.

He should have saw the blitz, it was right in front of him. It was his fault he got hit as the ball was thrown. I understand he has no feel for what's going on around him but he should be able to recognize and react to a blitz coming basically up the middle.

Judging from 5 years of watching Boller, I am of the opinion that he would have tried to force the ball into coverage and he telegraphs his throws staring at his primary read which he had done on that play.

Nearly everything sentence you posted is so incorrect it's hard to know where to start. If you're not Tex ghosting as another poster you're someone who knows as little about football as he does.

[FHRaven]

Tex, aren't you going to respond to my McGahee thread? I know it's embarrassing for you to be proven wrong....again but take your medicine like a man.

[StingerNLG]

Bollers wounded duck interception happened when? I thought it was late in the third quarter. No one player is responsible for the loss and I haven't seen anyone insinuate it. I have seen some insinuate Boller had a great second half. He didn't , Boller made some good plays the second half but some of the drives were aided by penalties. The Browns being another 30 something ranked defense Boller should have had his way with them from start to finish. I counted two interceptions one returned 100 yards.

Yes, I counted 2 interceptions. I also counted 4 scoring drives in the 4th quarter and 1 on the very first possession of the second half. No one said Boller didn't throw any interceptions. But when it came down to it, he made the plays necessary to put the team in a position to win.

The fact that everyone on the planet but you and Tex thinks he didn't have a great second half again goes to your bias and credibility when trying to have these discussions.

So just that we're clear, NO QB would look better than Boller?

Just to be clear, you think anyone else would take a pounding like that yesterday and do any better? Did you happen to watch the great Peyton Manning yesterday and last week when he was getting blasted and under pressure all day.

Here's a news flash about football. When you spend the whole day under constant pressure, even the hall-of-fame QB's don't play so well.

Boller should have recognized the blitz coming up the middle. His vision is poor, he may as well have blinders on plus he suffers from locking onto his primary read and staying there . Boller doesn't take into account anything else going on around him.

Oh I see, but the fact that he did exactly that multiple times in the second half means nothing. Of course not, we're talking to some one who really didn't watch the whole game.

The safety would have made a play on that ball either way. Whether the ball would have been intercepted is open for debate but there were two Brown defenders in the zone one being on the recievers back.

No......there wasn't. But whatever.

Boller was throwing into double and triple coverage all day long although there were some singles. I'm led to believe Boller makes up his mind were he's going with the ball before he breaks the huddle.

Your mind is made up that you will make up things to try and make Boller look worse than he did. He did not throw into triple and double coverage all day long. The fact is the Browns didn't have to double cover anyone, they were doing just fine play man on our receivers. Except Darling who broke free for his catches.

Wow, it is such a difference between talking to those who actually know what's happening or watch the games, then those who continue to make stuff up as they go along.

[StingerNLG]

Actually, in the first half he was trying to look all over the place and wouldn't pull the trigger until he looked at several options. It was quite obvious that at halftime they said "look to Mason, he is getting open" and he did. He made a few throws, he got some confidence and then things got a lot better.

What really annoys me is when people are so wrong, and they don't see the same things everyone else sees. There were times when Boller had to it McGahee in the middle because his outside receivers were covered. He looked across the field several times yesterday.

But why let facts get in the way of some good old fashioned Boller bashing? Greg, it will never change.

[purplepoe]

Here's my problem.

The same people who are praising Boller's 2nd half and him putting us in position to win are the same people would discredit McNair's games at Cleveland and Tennessee last year. Let's face it, Boller was horrendous in the 1st half just like McNair was in those 2 games last year.

Both players got the team into position to win. Yet the reactions are VASTLY different.

The Oline didn't all of a sudden start playing horribly on Sunday folks. McNair wasn't sitting back in the pocket with all day to throw either.

And therein lies the problem for me.

Boller made some good plays and some bad plays. He's obviously more explosive and should be starting for the remainder of this season.

The bomb to Clayton was underthrown. Period. Yes, Clayton should've made a better play on the ball and tried to break it up, but he had his man beat and Boller underthrew it. The rest of the 1st half was as bad as it gets as far as offensive football. And I don't think McNair would've done any better either.

The pick six was also on Boller IMO. Look folks, he's in his 5th year. The blitzer came straight up the middle and Boller saw him. You cannot start your throwing motion at that point. You just cannot do it.

On the other hand, in the 2nd half Boller made some very nice reads and throws while facing a lot of pressure. He did indeed get us into field goal position and that should've won the game (RUN THE BALL!!!!) but alas, it didn't.

But back to my original point. This game was similar to some games that we won with McNair last year. But those games were chalked up to other factors. To me both QBs contributed to the hole we dug and both dug us out of those holes.

Sadly, the lines have been drawn for some time and that doesn't seem to be changing.

PP

[Greg]

The problem is the Boller haters do the same thing, both camps do it. I have always believed Boller could be groomed, that there was more there. But I also believed McNair was the starter until hurt; until that Pissburgh game. McNair should not have started against Cincinnati and had Boller we might have won.

[purplepoe]

The problem is the Boller haters do the same thing, both camps do it. I have always believed Boller could be groomed, that there was more there. But I also believed McNair was the starter until hurt; until that Pissburgh game. McNair should not have started against Cincinnati and had Boller we might have won.

O, I agree 100% that there's a faction that does the same thing regarding Boller.

I think there are a few people who have meandered to the middle and can talk objectively about the QB situation.

Sadly, there aren't enough to squash the 2 factions.

I was on the fence about McNair starting the Cincy game. However, I wasn't on the fence when he wasn't benched when the game was 6-0 or 9-0. There's no way McNair should've been in that game past the first possession of the 3rd quarter.

PP

[StingerNLG]

O, I agree 100% that there's a faction that does the same thing regarding Boller.

I think there are a few people who have meandered to the middle and can talk objectively about the QB situation.

Sadly, there aren't enough to squash the 2 factions.

I was on the fence about McNair starting the Cincy game. However, I wasn't on the fence when he wasn't benched when the game was 6-0 or 9-0. There's no way McNair should've been in that game past the first possession of the 3rd quarter.

PP

The problem is that the extreme one half doesn't acknowledge that Boller makes mistakes, and the other half can't acknowledge that he can play well enough. Those in the middle tend to get pushed to one side or the other because you can't apparently have both opinions.

Some of us still take the same tact. Boller makes mistakes. Boller did underthrow the ball to Clayton. But Boller also plays well when the very basic fundamental of football playing is working; protection. And I don't mean "Well, the QB has to be able to pass the ball when protection breaks down". There was ZERO pass protection yesterday. Not some, not a little, NONE. Enough that Boller was forced to play most of the second half in the shotgun. And even then free blitzers came at him, when the Browns just rushed four guys!

Pass protection has been my problem with this team for years. It's beaten down now two former pro-bowl QB's, and has pretty much turned our other QB into a lightening rod for conversation. Until the OL gets taken care of, this discussion about QB "X" is going to continue on and on. I just have a problem with heaping every bad thing this offense does on the QB when that is not always the case.


I think PP the other point, which I made in the Tex thread, is that as a forum, we are giving too much attention to the extreme's on both sides. There are enough rational posters here that you can have a sane conversation. But instead of throwing guys like Tex on ignore, some decide to quote and respond to just about everything he says, and then it snowballs from there. When that stops, we can get back to having some sound and decent conversations about this team.

[StingerNLG]

Tell you what. Let's let Ray Lewis give his thoughts on Kyle Boller from Sunday's game:

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/spor...ly_speaks.html

“When you’re in that game the way you’re in that game and with all of the things that went down, I think the greatest thing you come out of there with is a pat on your young guys’ backs, especially [quarterback] Kyle [Boller] and especially [wide receiver Devard] Darling, and saying, ‘You know what? The next man stepped up no matter what. No matter our record, we went out there and we played yesterday.’ I’m proud of my team. I’m not proud of what happened in the outcome.”

Gee, Ray seems to think Boller stepped up. And on a radio show in which Ray Lewis doesn't have to say shit about Boller, especially after calling out his own coach weeks before.

So I guess Ray was just being cordial, right?

[Rayvens52]

How's this for a decent conversation. The Ravens offense sucks and it is primarily due to McNair being done and Boller never good enough to begin with. The OL is not the problem is it the horrid QB play that has been beyond putrid with either QB this season. If you can't see that you don't have a clue in the world about the game period.

No, you have no clue about this game. How can you say the OL has nothing to do with it. If you don't give a QB time or room to step forward not even Peyton or Brady could do shit here. Again just bevause Boller beat you up in a Bar one night does not mean everything is his fault. You think there is a reason why Mcgahee is not running wild, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm maybe bad OL play or is that Bollers fault to. Please watch a game before you speak again, i'm so tired of hearing you talk BS on this board.

[RustonRifle]

How's this for a decent conversation. The Ravens offense sucks and it is primarily due to McNair being done and Boller never good enough to begin with. The OL is not the problem is it the horrid QB play that has been beyond putrid with either QB this season. If you can't see that you don't have a clue in the world about the game period.

I see it, although I believe any QB will struggle to be average in Billicks stupid offense.

I get pegged as anti-Boller but its the crowd with the boy band type love for boller that comes here and posts what a fine job he did sunday that fuels my rebuttals.

Funny thing is, Boller is the best QB on this team right now and deserves to start. That said I knew certain fans would try to sell his paint by number performances as genuine picassos, as they always have.

[FHRaven]

How's this for a decent conversation. The Ravens offense sucks and it is primarily due to McNair being done and Boller never good enough to begin with. The OL is not the problem is it the horrid QB play that has been beyond putrid with either QB this season. If you can't see that you don't have a clue in the world about the game period.

The part in bold tells me you never actually watch the games or you are a raging idiot. Or both.

When the defense rushes 4 and the offense keeps 6 back to block and the Dlineman are coming through virtually untouched...you have a serious problem with OLine. Apparently, the team, the media and every fan except you realized this. You truly are this team's village idiot.

[4G63]

How's this for a decent conversation. The Ravens offense sucks and it is primarily due to McNair being done and Boller never good enough to begin with. The OL is not the problem is it the horrid QB play that has been beyond putrid with either QB this season. If you can't see that you don't have a clue in the world about the game period.

Tex, or should I say RustonRifle, I now believe you're crazy! As FHRaven said, the O-line was absolutely atrocious Sunday. I made a comment during the game on how the Browns rushed 4 and the Ravens had 6 blockers and he was sacked by 2 Browns!! You mean to tell me this is OK? They should be doing push-ups in the middle of the field after the game with how they played!!!

Everyone will see in 2 weeks how an O-line should play!!!

[Dade]

Tex, or should I say RustonRifle, I now believe you're crazy! As FHRaven said, the O-line was absolutely atrocious Sunday. I made a comment during the game on how the Browns rushed 4 and the Ravens had 6 blockers and he was sacked by 2 Browns!! You mean to tell me this is OK? They should be doing push-ups in the middle of the field after the game with how they played!!!

Everyone will see in 2 weeks how an O-line should play!!!

Face it 4G63 Tex will never get it. Better to just ignore him. But it is upsetting when people comment on subject matter they have no knowledge of.

[4G63]

Face it 4G63 Tex will never get it. Better to just ignore him. But it is upsetting when people comment on subject matter they have no knowledge of.

I realize that....there is just no gray area with him; Its ALWAYS Boller......

[FHRaven]

Sure, that happened some, just like it happened to McNair. But don't act like it happened the whole game or Boller wouldn't have even completed a pass, which I think he had little trouble the second half, only the first. So don't give me that b.s. excuse. Every QB faces pressure, its how he handles it that makes or breaks him. Boller did not handle it well at all in the first half and on that boneheaded play that he was picked. for the 100 yard TD return. Otherwise, though in the second half he generally handled the pressure much better and the line was also somewhat better.

Okay, so now you're contradicting yourself. Do you post from a mental institution? First the OLine was great, now they stink.

And yes, McNair had some poor OLine play this year. And you know, he looked worse than Boller ever has. Thanks for proving my point again.

[StingerNLG]

Okay, so now you're contradicting yourself. Do you post from a mental institution? First the OLine was great, now they stink.

And yes, McNair had some poor OLine play this year. And you know, he looked worse than Boller ever has. Thanks for proving my point again.

Remember, this is the guy that says our offensive line is as good as Pittsburgh's. Keep that in mind and then choose not to quote or respond to him for the love of real football talk.

[FHRaven]

Remember, this is the guy that says our offensive line is as good as Pittsburgh's. Keep that in mind and then choose not to quote or respond to him for the love of real football talk.

My apologies. After being pissed off about Sunday's loss I had to kick somebody around. And he always presents himself as such a target!

[highwater]

My apologies. After being pissed off about Sunday's loss I had to kick somebody around. And he always presents himself as such a target!

But it's like kicking an little annoying, yapping dog -- it feels good right away but eventually you realize it was just too easy, so there's no long-term gratification. Especially when the next day he's yapping again.

[flraven]

Notice that he hasn't come back to respond...

the silence is golden!