I've Come to Terms with K. Boller

**skaybaltimore** · 12-20-2006, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

Well, because he doesn't have to drop back.

I think part of his problem is he still drops back too quickly. His mind is on the read before the ball hits his hands and he fumbles. Then he gets back like he's The Flash. A lot of that was due to poor pass protection.

I'm not suggesting we experiment on Sunday against Pittsburgh by letting him play just because. But because I have placed a lot of onus on past horrible protection, I'd like to see how different Boller plays even on the road with the rest of the team playing as it is.

It would definitely answer my final question about his ability to play the game. If he can't do it when the OL is solid consistently, and the receivers aren't dropping passes intheir hands, then that will tell a lot.

I agree 100% with that, stinger; especially if there's ANY QUESTION WHATSOEVER with regard to whether on not that cut on McNair's hand has totally healed. In that instance, I wouldn't hesitate to let Sunday be a "well, let's see what KB can do". It's really tailor-made for that -- it's going to be an intense game, against a team KB has already faced this year, in what promises to be a very loud, hostile environment, with little if any major consequences if we lose, and a lot to gain if he shows he can handle that sort of pressure.

GO RAVENS!!!

**StingerNLG** · 12-20-2006, 03:47 PM

I definitely agree with you skay. But I think the real question before they make that switch is how important do they value the game.

Whether I like Kyle Boller or not, I am never in favor of sitting our starter unless it is absolutely necessary. I'm, with you on McNair's hand. I would call the cut on his hand not being totally healed necessary though. But if the Ravens want to keep pursuing home field advantage, you have to start McNair.

If this game to them is not that consequential, then I say go ahead and let the kid play. The Ravens need to see if they want to keep him.

**skaybaltimore** · 12-20-2006, 04:06 PM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

But I think the real question before they make that switch is how important do they value the game.

In my mind, SM's health is WAY more important than the outcome of the game. We need to look down the road a bit on this one, IMO.

(And btw --

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

I definitely agree with you skay.

Originally Posted by skaybaltimore

I agree 100% with that, stinger;

OF COURSE YOU AGREE WITH ME ON THIS ONE...Because it started out with me agreeing with you!! So if you didn't agree with me, then that would mean you didn't agree with yourself. And that would be kinda difficult, DON'T YA THINK?)

GO RAVENS!!!

**StingerNLG** · 12-20-2006, 07:29 PM

Look man, I'm trying to pack up a whole house and move in two days. I'm tired, cut me some slack.

In my mind, SM's health is WAY more important than the outcome of the game. We need to look down the road a bit on this one, IMO.

I know. It's a compelling arguement. Maybe they could start Boller, then if things start to go downhill fast McNair could come in. I'm just not a big fan of sitting your starter. It's a tricky situation.

**crazyraven** · 12-20-2006, 08:16 PM

In my mind, SM's health is WAY more important than the outcome of the game. We need to look down the road a bit on this one, IMO.

At this point in the season I'd like to see SM playing as long as we have a chance at a bye week or the 3rd seed. If we are locked in at a 3 seed then Mcnair needs to be rested and Boller should play a half or even 3 quarters.

**RavensNTerps** · 12-20-2006, 08:30 PM

1. Kyle Boller, Steve McNair, Anthony Wright, Derek Anderson, Brian St. Pierre, Drew Olsen...it doesn't matter...we're a better team than the Steelers...by far.

2. IF McNair's hand isn't healed, let Boller play...but it will be healed, and McNair will start. And we will win 23-6 or thereabouts.

**purplepoe** · 12-20-2006, 08:50 PM

I value this game because I want the Steelers out of the playoff hunt.

The AFC playoff picture could swing dramatically after Sunday's games.

PP

**Filmstudy** · 12-20-2006, 08:59 PM

The O-Line has had a fine year in pass blocking, allowing the 2nd fewest sacks in the league, but it would be foolish to give all the credit to them. It's also a function of McNair. IMO, Boller 2003-05 playing every snap and the Ravens would have allowed 25-28 sacks, slightly better than the 32 league average.

**purplepoe** · 12-20-2006, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by Filmstudy

The O-Line has had a fine year in pass blocking, allowing the 2nd fewest sacks in the league, but it would be foolish to give all the credit to them. It's also a function of McNair. IMO, Boller 2003-05 playing every snap and the Ravens would have allowed 25-28 sacks, slightly better than the 32 league average.

I agree.

Boller seems to have improved somewhat in his pocket presence but McNair's poise and presence is invaluable to this OL.

In fact, it was the biggest reason I wanted him over any of the available QBs. It was posted by myself and plenty of others that this OL would look better with McNair behind it.

Has the OL improved? Sure.

Has the playcalling lent itself to less sacks? Yup.

But this OL hasn't changed THAT dramatically to go from being as bad as it was to 2nd in sacks allowed.

People's biggest problem with the line was Flynn and him getting destroyed all the time. Well he's a year older this season and yet our sacks are way down. I believe the most improved guy is Pashos though. He's the unsung hero to me. Brown/Pashos/Chester (Im worried about Terry) are here for the long haul and that's a good thing.

Call it a combo of alot of things, but McNair is most definitely a main reason for the low sack number we've seen this season.

PP

**StingerNLG** · 12-20-2006, 10:13 PM

I value this game because I want the Steelers out of the playoff hunt.

The AFC playoff picture could swing dramatically after Sunday's games.

Is there a scenerio where a 9-7 Steelers makes it into the playoffs? I'd have to think a WHOLE LOT of stuff would have to happen for the Steelers to get in. I would think the Jets, Broncos, and the Jags would all have to lose the next 2 games, and Pittsburgh would have to beat us then go to Cincy and beat them. I just couldn't imagine it.

In fact, it was the biggest reason I wanted him over any of the available QBs. It was posted by myself and plenty of others that this OL would look better with McNair behind it.

Except a lot of the early games neither of them looked good. The OL has gotten better, and I don't mean this as a knock on Mulitalo at all, but the insertion of the young bucks I really think has had more to do with it than anything. Jason Brown has been really impressive, and I agree with you about Pashos really stepping up over the course of the season. These guys have been gelling through the season, and it's showing now.

But there is one guy we're forgetting that has really been solid in both run and pass protection; Ovie Mughelli. A lot of people were down on Ovie in the wake of losing Alan Ricard. But part of the issue was that Jim Fassel preferred to use an H Back instead of a straight 2 back set. So instead of having a fullback we had Dan Wilcox and Todd Heap playing that spot at times. It didn't work. When Billick took over, Ovie got the job, and I think he's done a solid job of picking up blitzes and helping protect McNair/Boller. And, he's another guy that can catch the ball out of the backfield, where Jamal really can't.

But this OL hasn't changed THAT dramatically to go from being as bad as it was to 2nd in sacks allowed.

But it sort of has. The majority of the time we've had two new guards on the line. Brown and Chester.

**Merlin** · 12-21-2006, 04:13 PM

After all we've been through with Boller the biggest mistake the front office could do is to let him go.

He won't be elite -- but I have a feeling that if someone will let him make the big play that some of those other issues -- tripping, not hanging in the pocket -- will become less -- and he could be a QB in the top half of the league.

Thank god for no Boller / Wright debates this year . . .

**purplepoe** · 12-21-2006, 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

But it sort of has. The majority of the time we've had two new guards on the line. Brown and Chester.

IIRC has Chester started 3 games.

Vincent came back to start the KC and Cleveland games and has definitely played the majority of the snaps this season.

And to be honest, I think Brown is now a very big upgrade over Mule. I wasn't sold on Edwin at the beginning of the year. Kept hearing what great shape he was in etc..... but it was pretty much the same old Edwin. Slowfooted and often injured.

Either way, Im excited about a Brown/Chester combo. A few people have said to me they think Chester will become a center and we know Brown played center in college. I would hope we'd grab another young G this offseason and really solidify the middle of the OL for years to come.

PP

**StingerNLG** · 12-21-2006, 07:52 PM

IIRC has Chester started 3 games.

Vincent came back to start the KC and Cleveland games and has definitely played the majority of the snaps this season.

NFL's stat pages for linemen always confuse me. He did start 3 games. But they have him listed as playing in 9, and "Did Not Play" in 6. I have no idea what that means.

And to be honest, I think Brown is now a very big upgrade over Mule. I wasn't sold on Edwin at the beginning of the year. Kept hearing what great shape he was in etc..... but it was pretty much the same old Edwin. Slowfooted and often injured.

I agree. I think it was important to get Mule back into playing shape this year, but Brown has really done well next to Ogden. And maybe helping Flynn out too which could be why Flynn hasn't been blown up so much.

So the question becomes, what happens when Ed becomes healthy?

**highwater** · 12-21-2006, 08:42 PM

And to be honest, I think Brown is now a very big upgrade over Mule.

I totally agree -- Brown has played very well. I might not call him a very big upgrade, but the OL has actually pass-blocked better (IMHO) since Mule went out. There hasn't been a drop-off, that's for sure. The OL has been much better at pass protection than I expected at the start of the season.

And while I think that McNair is very good at avoiding a pass rush, to give him all the credit is a little silly. The pass protection has improved largely because of the blocking, and that might be due to a combination of factors, including coaching, but whatever the reasons, it's a welcome change.

**purplepoe** · 12-21-2006, 09:55 PM

Originally Posted by StingerNLG

NFL's stat pages for linemen always confuse me. He did start 3 games. But they have him listed as playing in 9, and "Did Not Play" in 6. I have no idea what that means.

I agree. I think it was important to get Mule back into playing shape this year, but Brown has really done well next to Ogden. And maybe helping Flynn out too which could be why Flynn hasn't been blown up so much.

So the question becomes, what happens when Ed becomes healthy?

Yea, they have "did not play" for Ogden for every game. I went to NFL.com.

I said it as soon as he got injured that we saw the last of Mule in a Ravens uniform. He's just too slow and never healthy to warrant keeping him IMO.

[/QUOTE]And while I think that McNair is very good at avoiding a pass rush, to give him all the credit is a little silly[/QUOTE]

Im certainly not giving him all the credit. I don't think anyone really was.

PP

**PurpleRulz** · 12-21-2006, 10:41 PM

As far as "coming to terms with Boller" is concerned, the ONLY way I could see Boller having a second chance as a starter here is after a lot of the current vets depart. While players such as Clayton, Suggs, Bart, DWill, Terry, Pashos, Landry, etc., will be able to grow with Boller and tolerate him, guys like Ray, Reed, Mason (and don't buy the company line he touts on his show. He is not feeling Boller), and CMac will continue to view Boller with skeptical eyes.

**StingerNLG** · 12-22-2006, 07:45 PM

Mason (and don't buy the company line he touts on his show. He is not feeling Boller),

Sigh........

So he told you this personally, did he? Because I remember last year him telling a radio personality off the record (one who does not like Boller BTW), that he still had confidence in him.

So what did he tell you that was different?