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  1. #1
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    Great Rolling Stone Article



    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...for_a_maverick

    Some great lines: (the whole article is worth reading)

    "McCain's presence atop the ticket this year was evidence of profound anxiety within the party about its chances in the general election. After eight disastrous years of Bush, they thought they had lost the middle — so they picked a middling guy to get it back. Which made sense, right up until the moment when they stuck him with Pinochet in heels for a running mate."

    ...."American elections have long since ceased to be about issues and ideas. Instead, pompous cliché-spreaders like myself have argued, our TV-age political contests have devolved into grotesque marathons of mawkish entertainment programming, intellectually on par with a season of Survivor,"

    ...."By 2004, You had a millionaire Yalie in an army jacket taking on a millionaire Yalie in a cowboy hat, fighting tooth and nail for the right to be named the man "middle America most wants to have a beer with""


    ...."In short, McCain entered this election season being the worst thing that anyone can be, in the eyes of the Rove-school Republicans: Different. Independent. His own man. He exited the campaign on his knees, all his dignity gone, having handed the White House to the hated liberals after spending the last months of the race with numb-nuts Sarah Palin on his arm and Karl Rove's cock in his mouth. Even if you wanted to vote for him, you didn't know who you were voting for. The old McCain? The new McCain? Neither? Both?"

    ...."Like millions of Americans, I watched Barack Obama's victory on Election Night in a state of amazement. The only thing that gave me pause was the question of what kind of country this remarkable figure was now inheriting."

    ...."When Obama took the stage in Grant Park, this dumbed-down, degraded election process of ours has, in spite of itself and to my own extreme astonishment, brilliantly re-energized the American experiment and restored legitimacy to our status as the world's living symbol of individual freedom."

    ...."We feel like ourselves again"

    ...."For this to happen, absolutely everything had to break right. And for that we will someday owe sincere thanks to John McCain, and Sarah Palin, and George W. Bush. They not only screwed it up, they screwed it up just right."









  2. #2
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    And you called conservatives narcissistic?

    Last I checked, there were 58,343,671 voters that were not too happy Obama got elected.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  3. #3

    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...for_a_maverick

    Some great lines: (the whole article is worth reading)

    "McCain's presence atop the ticket this year was evidence of profound anxiety within the party about its chances in the general election. After eight disastrous years of Bush, they thought they had lost the middle — so they picked a middling guy to get it back. Which made sense, right up until the moment when they stuck him with Pinochet in heels for a running mate."

    ...."American elections have long since ceased to be about issues and ideas. Instead, pompous cliché-spreaders like myself have argued, our TV-age political contests have devolved into grotesque marathons of mawkish entertainment programming, intellectually on par with a season of Survivor,"

    ...."By 2004, You had a millionaire Yalie in an army jacket taking on a millionaire Yalie in a cowboy hat, fighting tooth and nail for the right to be named the man "middle America most wants to have a beer with""


    ...."In short, McCain entered this election season being the worst thing that anyone can be, in the eyes of the Rove-school Republicans: Different. Independent. His own man. He exited the campaign on his knees, all his dignity gone, having handed the White House to the hated liberals after spending the last months of the race with numb-nuts Sarah Palin on his arm and Karl Rove's cock in his mouth. Even if you wanted to vote for him, you didn't know who you were voting for. The old McCain? The new McCain? Neither? Both?"

    ...."Like millions of Americans, I watched Barack Obama's victory on Election Night in a state of amazement. The only thing that gave me pause was the question of what kind of country this remarkable figure was now inheriting."

    ...."When Obama took the stage in Grant Park, this dumbed-down, degraded election process of ours has, in spite of itself and to my own extreme astonishment, brilliantly re-energized the American experiment and restored legitimacy to our status as the world's living symbol of individual freedom."

    ...."We feel like ourselves again"

    ...."For this to happen, absolutely everything had to break right. And for that we will someday owe sincere thanks to John McCain, and Sarah Palin, and George W. Bush. They not only screwed it up, they screwed it up just right."
    There is not a single line that is not DEAD ON!




  4. #4

    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    And you called conservatives narcissistic?

    Last I checked, there were 58,343,671 voters that were not too happy Obama got elected.
    HR, if you look at this truthfully, you would have to agree it is an accurate analysis.




  5. #5
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    And you called conservatives narcissistic?

    Last I checked, there were 58,343,671 voters that were not too happy Obama got elected.
    Yeah and close to 10,000,000 (66,882,230) more that are very happy. 20% of the states changed to blue and zippo % changed to red. Not mention Obama more than doubling McCain in the E.C. In present day elections, that my friends was a blow out.

    Your comments, respectively, are consistent with my narcissistic assesment. Narcissistic in the sense that you are unable to get out of your own perspective and political needs in order to see the other side and how convicning this win was for them. Not to mention how silly the republicans looked in this last campaign and very few have the gonads or integrity to call a spade a spade but continue with the same droll...."Obama is not an american", "it was the liberal press", "Obama paid for the win" "we are still a center-right country" etc. etc. etc.

    One never recovers until they first admit there is a problem. One of the reason why clinical narcissists never get better.








  6. #6
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    Yeah and close to 10,000,000 (66,882,230) more that are very happy. 20% of the states changed to blue and zippo % changed to red. Not mention Obama more than doubling McCain in the E.C. In present day elections, that my friends was a blow out
    Poor grasp of election history. You have to go clear back to JFK to find a Democrat winning the white house by a majority of the votes. Carter and Clinton won by a plurality of the votes. And your "20% increase in blue states" is exaggerating the outcome as well. We only have 50 states, G7. A 20% swing would mean that 10 states changed from Red to blue. That did not happen. Two states shifted (Ohio and PA) and they have historically been swing / battleground states.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    Your comments, respectively, are consistent with my narcissistic assesment. Narcissistic in the sense that you are unable to get out of your own perspective and political needs in order to see the other side and how convicning this win was for them
    I never once said it was not a convincing win. Obama won. No doubt about it. He got the votes, ran the better campaign and won a fair and square election. What it was not is some sort of blow out, mandate style election. No matter how you try and twist it (or say it's some egoist move on my part), history will show this is a Dem winning an election when they were supposed to win an election.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    Not to mention how silly the republicans looked in this last campaign and very few have the gonads or integrity to call a spade a spade but continue with the same droll...."Obama is not an american", "it was the liberal press", "Obama paid for the win" "we are still a center-right country" etc. etc. etc.
    No conservative I read, watch, etc has said anything other then the obvious -- the GOP got their butts kicked. The reason's for that butt kicking have been all brought to light by numerous pundits on our side. You seem to be selective on who you listen to from our side. The Georgia run off is a perfect example. The Dem there actually LOST support, running along side Obama AFTER his election win and AFTER he managed to come to a virtual tie with a very popular incumbent Senator. Exit polls show that folks are already pointing out that Obama has reneged on a bunch of promises.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    One never recovers until they first admit there is a problem. One of the reason why clinical narcissists never get better.
    You're right. Just curious when you will man up and admit your problem.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  7. #7
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by Rochardrik View Post
    HR, if you look at this truthfully, you would have to agree it is an accurate analysis.
    Take out the opinion of the author, and I would say about 75% is dead on.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  8. #8
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Poor grasp of election history. You have to go clear back to JFK to find a Democrat winning the white house by a majority of the votes. Carter and Clinton won by a plurality of the votes. And your "20% increase in blue states" is exaggerating the outcome as well. We only have 50 states, G7. A 20% swing would mean that 10 states changed from Red to blue. That did not happen. Two states shifted (Ohio and PA) and they have historically been swing / battleground states.


    Wouldn't turning Nevada, Colorado, New Mexico, Indiana, Iowa, Ohio, Virginia, North Carolina, Florida and 1/3 of Nebraska from Bush Red to Obama Blue mean that 20% of the states that were red in '04 were blue in '08? Isn't 9.3 out of 50 just about 20%? You're right I did exaggerate. 18.6% of Bush states went to Obama while 0% (right 0 out of 50?) of Kerry states went to McCain. By the way, Pennsylvania didn't shift.

    Maybe I am not reading something right but what I said seems pretty clear and not ambiguous enough for even you to defend against.




    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    The Georgia run off is a perfect example. The Dem there actually LOST support, running along side Obama AFTER his election win and AFTER he managed to come to a virtual tie with a very popular incumbent Senator. Exit polls show that folks are already pointing out that Obama has reneged on a bunch of promises.
    There is something ironic about a conservative pointing out that in the great state of Georgia the "Dems actually lost support". If I ever say the same thing about Maryland or California be sure to correct me that I shouldn't be holding that up as some type of leverage that the Dems are doing just fine.



    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    You're right. Just curious when you will man up and admit your problem.
    Maybe soon after you are able to see that 18.6% is pretty close to 20%. Until then, I will stick to my opinion that Obama was clearly the better candidate and that clearly was demonstrated in the election. Better than that, in four years I am almost positive I won't be throwing my candidate under the bus like 80% of the republicans have done to Bush after cheering so rabidly for him after '04. But that will take four years to prove that point.








  9. #9
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    Wouldn't turning Nevada, Colorado, New Mexico, Indiana, Iowa, Ohio, Virginia, North Carolina, Florida and 1/3 of Nebraska from Bush Red to Obama Blue mean that 20% of the states that were red in '04 were blue in '08? Isn't 9.3 out of 50 just about 20%? You're right I did exaggerate. 18.6% of Bush states went to Obama while 0% (right 0 out of 50?) of Kerry states went to McCain. By the way, Pennsylvania didn't shift
    My bad. I misunderstood your original claim. Still though, many of the states that turned were still historically battleground states and turn with the political tide.

    Even with a uber amount of help from the MSM, this was not even close to the blow out you claim. Again, it's all in the history books.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    There is something ironic about a conservative pointing out that in the great state of Georgia the "Dems actually lost support". If I ever say the same thing about Maryland or California be sure to correct me that I shouldn't be holding that up as some type of leverage that the Dems are doing just fine
    Nothing ironic at all. Again, no grasp of history. Yes, Georgia is a red state and that lends it self to the smoke-and-mirrors campaign Obama ran, with the help of the MSM. Once he was elected and started showing his brand of change (selecting Clinton cronies and Clinton her self, backing off his opposition to the auto bailout, stating troops will be in Iraq for a while, etc) the curtain was pulled back and the huge gain the Dems made in a such a red state were immediately erased.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne View Post
    Maybe soon after you are able to see that 18.6% is pretty close to 20%. Until then, I will stick to my opinion that Obama was clearly the better candidate and that clearly was demonstrated in the election. Better than that, in four years I am almost positive I won't be throwing my candidate under the bus like 80% of the republicans have done to Bush after cheering so rabidly for him after '04. But that will take four years to prove that point.
    You're correct. He ran the better campaign and was the better candidate. The election clearly shows this to be true.

    Yes, you probably wont ever look at Obama in a negative light because your side will never look at their politicians in anything other then a favorable light. As long as they are well intended, be damned with the outcome of their service. Conservatives, on the other hand, know when to turn our backs on a lemon --- or in poker terms, know when to fold a bad hand -- for the sake of the country and our ideals.

    And yes, it will take 4 years to prove your point. However, you have intuition on your side. My side has history. It took the likes of President Carter to give us President Reagan and Obama is well down that path already. That was the only true blow out election of our time.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  10. #10
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    My bad. I misunderstood your original claim. Still though, many of the states that turned were still historically battleground states and turn with the political tide.

    Even with a uber amount of help from the MSM, this was not even close to the blow out you claim. Again, it's all in the history books.
    yep all about that "uber" support from the media. Couldn't have been anything else but that. when all else fails, blame the media, If this uber support was such a reality then how in the hell was Bush elected twice? really? Seriously? Still have Annie as your desktop background?



    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Nothing ironic at all. Again, no grasp of history. Yes, Georgia is a red state and that lends it self to the smoke-and-mirrors campaign Obama ran, with the help of the MSM. Once he was elected and started showing his brand of change (selecting Clinton cronies and Clinton her self, backing off his opposition to the auto bailout, stating troops will be in Iraq for a while, etc) the curtain was pulled back and the huge gain the Dems made in a such a red state were immediately erased.
    yep there is that ol' MSM again. Keep blaming the media. you speak of "clinton cronies" as if there is something wrong. I really hated the 8 years of peace, surplus, millions of jobs created, strong moral standing worldwide...we can only hope for a return to that minus the intern.

    You should be happy to see he he might not so quickly bailout the auto industry. Isn't that a good thing in your book? You really think that helped Saxby in the run off? Did you notice that Obama didn't even go to Georgia? Your train of thought is all over the place...in the end, i tend to believe that you are just a hater and want to go against whatever the flow is.

    To use a quote from Beeten, "Last time I checked, 41% was a failing grade. Not so in the Senate it would appear. No, now that Chambliss has won, apparently having just 41 votes in the Senate is REALLY great news for Republicans and bad news for Democrats, especially President-elect Barack Obama. Right, a 41 vote minority should by all means have Barack Obama shaking in his boots."

    One measly win in a southern state run off and suddenly the mandate is against Obama. That's really funny to me.


    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    Yes, you probably wont ever look at Obama in a negative light because your side will never look at their politicians in anything other then a favorable light. As long as they are well intended, be damned with the outcome of their service. Conservatives, on the other hand, know when to turn our backs on a lemon --- or in poker terms, know when to fold a bad hand -- for the sake of the country and our ideals.
    Please save your righteous unyielding sense of patriotism for those who lack the experience in the world to believe that there is something noble in acting in that manner.

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    And yes, it will take 4 years to prove your point. However, you have intuition on your side. My side has history. It took the likes of President Carter to give us President Reagan and Obama is well down that path already. That was the only true blow out election of our time.
    The Second Reich of the Republican party....if you can't find an angle to to insert "its the liberal media" then quickly insert Ronald Reagan. That will prove your point. Whatever it is....something about Obama also being like Carter? I think? He's not even President yet bro...








  11. #11
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    G7,

    You need to take a reading comprehension class or something. I never said the media got Obama elected, or that it was the media's fault, etc.

    The MSM certainly helped and an independent, non-partisan media think tank agrees with me.

    And if you think the majority people in this country view the Clinton's as being moral, you might want to get out of your liberal bubble more.

    "One measly win in a southern state run off and suddenly the mandate is against Obama. That's really funny to me."

    Pride comes before the fall. Nah, you're not narcissistic at all.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  12. #12
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    Re: Great Rolling Stone Article

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    G7,

    You need to take a reading comprehension class or something. I never said the media got Obama elected, or that it was the media's fault, etc.
    Really?

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    The MSM certainly helped and an independent, non-partisan media think tank agrees with me.
    So then where was this powerful liberal media when numbnuts Bush was elected twice??? Since you didn't have an answer the first time, I will suggest an answer. Jerome Corsi and the conservative media beat them to it because the Democrats never saw it coming. If you don't think Corsi, et al gave the election to Bush in '04 then you are blind. When the conservative media tried it this year, Obama already had his answers sketched out. It wasn't the liberal media that won or "certainly helped",it was the liberal media that pushed back this year against the conservative media that won it. we didn't accept that Obama was a terrorist, or an alien, or a socialist or a guy that no one knows about. In reality the liberal media neutralized the conservative media and allowed the better candidate to win.

    Any more coverage Obama received over Mccain was for the same reason that last year the New England Patriots received more media coverage that the Detroit Lions.

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    And if you think the majority people in this country view the Clinton's as being moral, you might want to get out of your liberal bubble more.
    Never said the majority I said just myself. Talk about reading comprehension. I didn't care about the whole Monica Lewinsky thing and I bet that deep down you could care less about that as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by HoustonRaven View Post
    "One measly win in a southern state run off and suddenly the mandate is against Obama. That's really funny to me."

    Pride comes before the fall. Nah, you're not narcissistic at all.

    And becasue you have such special powers and supreme intellect to know that for sure there is a fall coming that my pride is just what you say it is. I know it is hard for you to step out of yourself for just a moment to see how narcissistic that comment is but you should try it because it is exactly what I have been referring to. Do you mind if I use some of your discussions during consultation/supervision meetings? they can be real gems.








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