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  1. #85

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??



    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    That's the thing though, it is simple.
    Oh, you won't trick me into this debate, thank you very much. Everyone's points have been made, and readers of this lengthy thread have seen the arguments. I was following along contentedly myself, until the repetition set in.

    It crept from :watching: to :brickwall: as debates can sometimes do.
    Festivus

    His definitions and arguments were so clear in his own mind that he was unable to understand how any reasonable person could honestly differ with him.




  2. Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    I didnt want to read through 5 pages of posts, but seems like you are talking about poverty, out of work, uneducated deadbeats??? OH I get it, its a Steelers fan thread!

    Im not really ino political discussions, i fall more in line with the average american.....all i want to know is, who else did tom brady knock up?? (thats the american way, we dont care about solving world issues we just want our american idol and entertainment tonight!)

    Speaking of which did anyone else find the new report of the Iranians being upset about the "300" movie, saying it shows iranians in a bad light??? They are assuming the american public knows that persians come from persia, and persia is where modern day iran is. We aren that smart!
    Season ticket holder since 1996 Section 148 Tailgate Lot H
    See my photos and video at www.bmoreravens.com




  3. #87
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    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Damn.

    LOL, you are a rare one. I enjoy debates, and though it isn't the case this time, I occassionally will even debate the side of an argument I don't agree with. Despite the assumption that I don't look at all sides of an argument I actually do. I can usually argue both sides equally well.




  4. Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Quote Originally Posted by highwater View Post
    This has been a fascinating thread for getting to know some people's credentials -- Raven Nurse has a minor in Psychology, CBD is a graduate student in Political Science and lives with a French Libertarian, and crazyraven is a certified moron who doesn't have the common sense to clear ice off the roof of his car.

    Pretty soon, we'll be posting our resumes on this thread.
    lol
    I say we all gang up together, flog Dave's roomie, and ship his butt back to France.

    Just sayin. Would that be so wrong?




  5. #89

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Whats up with peoples ratings? From one day to another they jump from one green dot to about 10 on some people




  6. Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    I hate ratings. Always have. I always vote to get rid of them. Say something someone doesn't like, and the whack you. And as was pointed out, they don't always work correctly anyway.

    But that is up to the big boss. I don't even know how to work the feature.




  7. #91

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    CAN YOU NAME ONE PERSON WHO HAS DONE THE THREE THINGS NOTED AND IS IN POVERTY?

    Selection Bias. You wouldn't know one because you yourself are successful and probably middle class to upper middle class.


    If you've worked with people at homeless shelters, which I bet you haven't, you would know that lots of people fall on hard times regardless of education status because of being laid off, because of mental health problems, because of medical conditions and the medical bills that may come with that.


    A good example is a homeless man that my uncle encountered that was an upstanding individual; college schooled, etc etc worked at a Jewlry Store. Store got robbed and he was hit with a shotgun blast to the head.


    In a coma for a few weeks, come out and they're bassically waitinf for the pieces of his fractured skull to naturally float out of his brain along with shotgun pellets.


    Long story short, he's disfigured, has a plate over the front of his head, had mental problems from said brain damage and is homeless.


    People fall on hard times for a number of reasons. they are not all to be blamed on the individual.


    As a libertarian, I would expect you to think so though. And you're living up to the billing. My roomate thinks the same way, BUT he doesn't state the opinions as fact, or pretend that studies publishes in the Economist are fact. Why? Because he's trained to understand that its not that black or white.


    If it was "simple" then we wouldn't have politics, or be having this discussion. Period.




  8. #92

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Quote Originally Posted by ClericBlackDave View Post
    Selection Bias. You wouldn't know one because you yourself are successful and probably middle class to upper middle class.


    If you've worked with people at homeless shelters, which I bet you haven't, you would know that lots of people fall on hard times regardless of education status because of being laid off, because of mental health problems, because of medical conditions and the medical bills that may come with that.


    A good example is a homeless man that my uncle encountered that was an upstanding individual; college schooled, etc etc worked at a Jewlry Store. Store got robbed and he was hit with a shotgun blast to the head.


    In a coma for a few weeks, come out and they're bassically waitinf for the pieces of his fractured skull to naturally float out of his brain along with shotgun pellets.


    Long story short, he's disfigured, has a plate over the front of his head, had mental problems from said brain damage and is homeless.


    People fall on hard times for a number of reasons. they are not all to be blamed on the individual.


    As a libertarian, I would expect you to think so though. And you're living up to the billing. My roomate thinks the same way, BUT he doesn't state the opinions as fact, or pretend that studies publishes in the Economist are fact. Why? Because he's trained to understand that its not that black or white.


    If it was "simple" then we wouldn't have politics, or be having this discussion. Period.

    Ummm, that is quite an extreme example isn't it Dave?

    Sure, there are circumstances that occur that are out of certain individuals control. That happens in all walks of life. However, it's certianly not the norm.

    Nevermind the real world. We'll just pretend that everything happens in a classroom or a textbook.

    I love how somebody else can't know anything because they are middle or upper class. But since you have a poly sci degree, you do?

    Face it Dave, you want to make excuses for other people's bad choices. And Greg is dead on when saying that people who do that are worse than people making the bad choices.

    Just take a walk through the city of Baltimore. You don't need a degree to see how the lack of father's in the lives of children is destroying the fabric of the city.

    All of your jargon and rhetoric just clouds reality. And that, in turn, is leading us further down the wrong path.

    PP




  9. #93

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    PurplePoe:


    The reality is people can fall on hard times, regardless of education or not having kids out of wedlock, etc.


    People who say, are the only child of their parents, and who's parents die, and have little to no kinship network left only need to be laid off once, have one serious disease or accident, one mental health breakdown, or one generally unlucky event to fall on hard times.


    People who are middle class to upper class like Greg, maybe you PP, whoever, will try to put this on the "sins" or mistakes of the poor.


    But don't get it twisted, people fall on hard times and its often not their fault.


    Studies like the one Greg are citing usually have many evident selection biases as to get a result which the funder of the study would like.


    If you don't understand what selection bias is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias


    In any case, people like Greg who state studies and statistics as "facts" are usually people who dont' like to recognize that studies are often political and baised, and people who just need to take a few simple social science statistic classes to realize that data can be made to look like what the funders want.


    People fall on hard times, and many times, its not their fault. They don't need to get shit on on a message board by people who don't know and don't care about them, but share a certain political point of view and want to think the Economist is hard "fact"


    How about this: instead of relying on the economist, go down to your local homeless shelter. Do some community service: a large enough "N" size so that this little experiment has statistical significance.


    Ask you average homeless joe who you're serving soup how he/she got there. You'd be suprised.


    -CBD




  10. #94

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Quote Originally Posted by ClericBlackDave View Post
    PurplePoe:


    The reality is people can fall on hard times, regardless of education or not having kids out of wedlock, etc.


    People who say, are the only child of their parents, and who's parents die, and have little to no kinship network left only need to be laid off once, have one serious disease or accident, one mental health breakdown, or one generally unlucky event to fall on hard times.


    People who are middle class to upper class like Greg, maybe you PP, whoever, will try to put this on the "sins" or mistakes of the poor.


    But don't get it twisted, people fall on hard times and its often not their fault.


    Studies like the one Greg are citing usually have many evident selection biases as to get a result which the funder of the study would like.


    If you don't understand what selection bias is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias


    In any case, people like Greg who state studies and statistics as "facts" are usually people who dont' like to recognize that studies are often political and baised, and people who just need to take a few simple social science statistic classes to realize that data can be made to look like what the funders want.


    People fall on hard times, and many times, its not their fault. They don't need to get shit on on a message board by people who don't know and don't care about them, but share a certain political point of view and want to think the Economist is hard "fact"


    How about this: instead of relying on the economist, go down to your local homeless shelter. Do some community service: a large enough "N" size so that this little experiment has statistical significance.


    Ask you average homeless joe who you're serving soup how he/she got there. You'd be suprised.


    -CBD
    You know what's funny Dave?

    You repeatedly make generalizations about anyone in middle or upper class. How they can't understand the topic at hand.

    Do you not see the complete and utter contradiction in that?

    You sound like a professor. I went to college and have a degree as well Dave. I remember listening to professors spew and spew thinking they were presenting a fair and balanced point of view.

    Then I went into the the real world and realized it was 99% complete and utter biased bullshit.

    Im not "upper" class Dave. And I've volunteered at homeless shelters on many more occasions than you might think.

    And yes, there are stories that are sad and that I have sympathy for.

    HOWEVER, those stories and situations are dwarfed by the situations caused by poor decisions.

    And you know what? MANY of those people making poor decisions come from broken homes with no father in the picture.

    Nobody is saying people can't fall on hard times Dave. I have friends who grew up wealthy with both parents are are completely screwed up.

    What some of us are saying is that a good, solid home with both parents significantly helps and child become a successful member of society.

    It's not selection bias. It's not anything but reality.

    Check it out.

    PP




  11. #95

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    Quote Originally Posted by camdenyard View Post
    Greg knows what he is talking about. He talks like a parent who knows about responsibility, not a man-child who thinks he can screw anyone he wants and if there is an "oops" pull out a checkbook and make it go away at worst or at best get away with it.

    He's also right that our culture is going down the shitter. We need more of the 1950s values in this country.
    The 50's "values" are waaaaay overrated, and hardly applicable to now. What, you want an America where midle class, and wealth are reserved for wasps? Championing the ways of the '50's is advocating racism. You cannot seperate the two! It's impossible!




  12. #96

    Re: Tom Brady is father to 2 children??

    I nominate this thread and all its posts as the WORST ever posted on this board




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