Page 6 of 17 FirstFirst ... 234567891016 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 72 of 194
  1. #61

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...



    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    I don't know how a Ravens can be disappointed by what this guy did on sundays.
    Because he still missed a lot of time, got a lot of help on Sundays and, largely by his own doing, never reached his true potential.

    Sorry, but he proved to be unreliable. As others have said, he's a very talented engima.

    There's a reason he got a 1-year, $685K deal instead of the multi-million dollar deal you expected him to get.

    It's very easy to be disappointed by the noticeably worse production we have gotten at the tackle positions since his departure
    Sure, it is, but that's an unrelated issue, separate from Gaither and his shortcomings as far as dedication, etc. It has nothing to do with being disappointed by Gaither - other than hi-light was could have, should have been - and the fact that he should have been better had he applied himself.

    I'm quite sure the Ravens are very disappointed as well.
    “Talk's cheap - let’s go play.” - #19, Johnny Unitas

    Follow me on Twitter @ravenssalarycap




  2. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Deep in the bowels of Maryland suburbia
    Posts
    1,713

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Given the history with Gaither, I have no problem with the Ravens parting ways with him.

    What I DO have a problem with is their (apparent) failure to adequately address the O-line deficiencies, at least to this point. Everyone's known since last season that a) Gaither's return in 2011 was doubtful at best, b) Chester was so-so at guard, c) Yanda being forced to play RT isn't the best use of his talents, d) Birk is aging and his 2010 play reflected that, and e) the O-line play in 2010 was clearly a step down from what it had been in 2009.

    So, what do they do? One 3rd round draft choice who might be able to start at some point this season. That's pretty much it, aside from a crop of UDFA's who largely exist as camp fodder.

    I can easily live with Gaither's departure. But I want to see concrete steps taken to shore up this O-line. Addition by subtraction isn't good enough in this case.




  3. #63
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,146
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by trailhiker85 View Post
    What I DO have a problem with is their (apparent) failure to adequately address the O-line deficiencies, at least to this point. ....One 3rd round draft choice who might be able to start at some point this season. That's pretty much it, aside from a crop of UDFA's who largely exist as camp fodder.

    I can easily live with Gaither's departure. But I want to see concrete steps taken to shore up this O-line. Addition by subtraction isn't good enough in this case.
    There are a few factors to consider in your criticism.

    The first is the number of picks the team has been willing to invest in offensive linemen.

    On the surface it may not seem like a lot. But by my calculation, in the last five drafts, they have taken 8 offensive linemen (2 ones, 3 threes, a four and five and a six). That's 22% of their picks. And offensive linemen represent 22% of the starting positions (5/22).

    (Go back further to 2005 and 2006, and you find a couple of twos, and a four)

    When you factor in the need for special teams "starters," which offensive lineman don't really contribute to, they have actually over-selected this position.

    So they have certainly spent the capital.

    The real question is whether they've adequately developed linemen. In other words, it's not the lack of trying that I would criticize. It's the lack of acheiving.

    Over those seven years the list of guys who failed to develop is unpleasant. Adam Terry, Chris Chester, Oniel Cousins, David Hale, Jared Gaither. The jury is out on Oher. And it's too early on Reid and Harewood.

    That leaves Grubbs and Yanda, both from the same draft, as their only solid draft-and-develop linemen in the last seven years.

    We've been through the same thing with wide receivers, and to some extent corners -- and before Flacco, quarterbacks. It has forced them out onto the free agent market, and that always hurts.

    You want running backs, tight ends, d-linemen, linebackers or safeties? The Ravens can do that.




  4. #64

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by jonboy79 View Post
    Ummm, last year, same player, same reaction.

    He is simply HATED by the average Baltimore fan. It doesn't matter what he does, it's wrong.
    He's skinny, and the fans complain he sat on his ass, and that his frame would require him to work hard to stay at 340 or higher.
    This year, he's back up to ideal playing weight, and the jealous Ravens fans call him fat....

    It's pretty humorous sour grapes. Wait until he plays well against us this week, the board as a whole will find a way to slam him down, even if he grossly outperforms Quentin Aaron.
    Not all weight is created equal. He was too skinny last year, because he didn't have enough MUSCLE. Just because he's added back some weight (in the way of fat, clearly) doesn't mean he's added back the necessary strength. This is coming from someone who was one of Gaither's biggest supporters not very long ago so put the "conspiracy" bs to rest.




  5. #65
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Deep in the bowels of Maryland suburbia
    Posts
    1,713

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by Shas View Post

    The real question is whether they've adequately developed linemen. In other words, it's not the lack of trying that I would criticize. It's the lack of acheiving.
    That may well be the case. But I would argue that the "lack of achieving", as you put it -- and the contemporary consequences resulting from it -- have been known for some time now. The horrible O-line performance from last Thursday's game shouldn't have come as a surprise to anyone. And as much as I'd like to think it was a fluke, I don't.

    It's hard to find fault with the 2011 draft itself since rounds 1 and 2 were used for CB and WR -- two other holes that needed addressing. This may be, in part, a case of a team simply having too many holes to fill at one time. Not a pleasant thought when you hope to contend for a SB, but a real one nonetheless.

    It's possible I see the O-line issues as more pressing in part because of its importance to our franchise QB. As Flacco goes, so go the Ravens. And while having Rice, Boldin, and now Lee Evans join with Joe at the so-called "skill positions" is wonderful, I think last Thursday's game is a wake-up call for what is essentially our achilles heel on offense.

    Of course, it ain't a perfect world and no team can be strong everywhere. Hopefully the OL play will improve. My guess -- and hope -- is that at least one OL vet gets added to the mix before the season opens.




  6. #66
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,146
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by trailhiker85 View Post
    My guess -- and hope -- is that at least one OL vet gets added to the mix before the season opens.
    If not, they're in trouble.

    It's the same as the WR and CB position we both pointed to. For many drafts in a row they didn't spend a top pick on these positions -- maybe because they liked a lineman like Oher and Grubbs, or the quarterback Flacco -- and so they were forced to go out onto the market and patch a hole with the likes of Foxworth, Washington, Carr, Wilson, Boldin, Houshmanzadeh, Mason, Evans, et al.

    In an ideal world, all the picks would work out and they wouldn't need free agents.

    The next-best scenario is that Torrey Smith and Tandon Doss and Jah Reid and Michael Oher fully develop and these are the guys who step up when the current crop of veteran free agents are done.




  7. #67

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Good stuff Shas...

    But you bring up the point of development with these draft picks... I think that Oz, Eric D, and the scouts just drafted poor talent, and the coaching staff couldnt polish a bunch of turds. Eric D talked up the 1st round 'potential' talent of Chester, and Cousins, who were both inexperience... Well drafting potential gets FO execs and coaches fired. Contrast that to drafting a solid but unspectacular Yanda... Also Oher fell in the draft... maybe some of the teams that passed on him will be correct in thinking that Oher will never develop into a great LT (#23 in the draft is a bit too high for a RT)

    I'll call it like it is... our OL scouting for the draft isn't very good.




  8. #68

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    If Gaither showed up to practice...
    Cousins would attempt to block him

    and would whiff




  9. #69
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    368

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    I rest my case!!!




  10. #70
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,146
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by ravensnhokies View Post
    Eric D talked up the 1st round 'potential' talent of Chester, and Cousins, who were both inexperience... Well drafting potential gets FO execs and coaches fired. Contrast that to drafting a solid but unspectacular Yanda... Also Oher fell in the draft... maybe some of the teams that passed on him will be correct in thinking that Oher will never develop into a great LT (#23 in the draft is a bit too high for a RT).
    Uh oh. Here it comes....

    I've espoused my draft philosophy many times. Hmm, "philosophy" sounds pretentious. Call it a draft observation. It goes like this:

    The Ravens get in trouble when they pick a certain player who looks the part of a great player, but has fallen down the draft board due to a lack of production in college. These are usually the players who they have taken in the second and third rounds who possesed some trait, usually size or athleticism, that convinces the team the player is a diamond in the rough. They become convinced that the player is a first round talent with a second or third round price tag. To wit:

    Chris Chester -- converted tight end who was the fastest lineman in the combine and just needed to add bulk.

    Oniel Cousins -- The Jamaican-born, big-bodied, former DT with the nasty meanstreak just needed some more experience to unlock his potential.

    Adam Terry -- Extremely tall, athletic, and long -- looked like a prototype left tackle.

    Tavarous Gooden -- tremendous sideline-to-sideline speed.

    Yamon Figurs -- fastest forty time at the combine.

    David Pittman -- tremendous D-II athlete who simply needed to experience better competition and coaching

    Jared Gaither -- huge specimen who just needed to mature and take the game seriously.

    On the flip side, some of the best picks are players who don't look the part, and don't seem to have a natural position in the NFL, but who were very productive in college. Ironically, these guys are sometimes fall even further than the tape-measure divas. To wit:

    Ray Lewis -- too small

    Ray Rice -- too small, won't be durable

    Marshal Yanda -- bad body; is he a guard or tackle?

    Jarrett Johnson -- who remembers Jarrett as a fat DT, wearing #76 for the Ravens? Two-time captain at Alabama was too small to play in the NFL until the Ravens figured out where to use him.

    Adalius Thomas -- basketball player with no real position ended up excelling at almost every defensive position

    Brandon Stokely -- before there was a Wes Welker and Austin Collie....

    Terrance Cody -- laughed at as a big, fat blob at the combine.

    It's not foolproof. Dan Cody was very productive in college, and should have been a bargain. But he couldn't stay healthy. We'll see if Sergio Kindle is the next Cody, or if he can stay healthy and be productive.

    I think the jury is out on Lardarius Webb. I can't tell if they are projecting him, coming from a small school. Or if he is simply a "football player" who didn't come into the league with a natural position -- safety or corner?

    Using the same measuring stick, I'm actually encouraged about Paul Kruger. I think he is following the Jarrett Johnson career trajectory, and I'm hopeful that now that they have given up trying to convert him into a bigger-body DE, he can excel as a big OLB.

    I also like David Reed and Dennis Pitta because they possess transferrable skills (hands, brains, toughness), rather than projectable abilities. (Ed Dickson worried me because I think he is more of a projection player).

    Which brings me to Jah Reid. I know everyone is high on him. But I see a guy who wasn't exactly a college all-star. The Ravens rave about his potential, and how they got a tremendous bargain in the third round because he's so huge and they are just sure he fits the mold of a top-flight tackle. Uhh....that sounds eerily familar and hopeful, to this historian.

    Ramone Harewood probably fits the same profile, but at least he was a sixth-round project and I can live with taking a few seasons to see how/if he develops.

    If you notice, the Ravens' too-frequent lack of success with offensive linemen shares a common theme of projecting what they think guys can become, rather than selecting known quanities (J.O., Grubbs, Yanda, Muliatalo, Brown, Oher -- players who were projected as nothing other than the type of linemen they already were in college and nothing more).

    If you are still reading my endless blather, my rule of thumb, once you get past the first round, is take the low-ceiling, high-effort, smart, "football player" every time over the high-ceiling, unproven "athlete."




  11. #71
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    College Park via Ellicott City (MD)
    Posts
    188

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Quote Originally Posted by BLSmokey View Post
    Jared Gaither is in Kansas City and hasn't even suited up for the Ravens since 2009.

    He's moved on. Some fans need to as well.

    Personally, I wish him well.


    What's done is done. From all accounts I'd say the Ravens are moving forward with Micheal Oher at LT. Has he struggled? Yes, but just like any other position in football he can and will get better. He has 1st round talent and played LT in college so he has the skill--just needs to improve on consistency.




  12. #72

    Re: If Gaither showed up to practice...

    Some of the past few posts have enunciated a mal-formed thought that has been bubbling in the back of my mind:
    We waste too many 2nd and 3rd round choices on projects. I have often thought of those two rounds as Ozzie's ego rounds, when he rolls the dice because he has TOO much confidence in his ability.

    Do we have bad drafting or bad coaching of the people we draft? It would seem the former, because few (not none, few) of our failures go on to have solid careers with other NFL teams. (Recently Adam Terry signed on with the Titans(?) and Devard Darling with the Texans, we'll see how they do.)

    IMHO we should expect a 2nd rounder to be a solid starter, and a 3rd rounder should make a contribution as a solid backup or ST'er. Too many of the players we've taken in those two rounds have done too little (or nothing) to justify the pick. Oz, gamble with rounds 6 and 7; go for solid projects in 4th and 5th. Take blue chips in the first three rounds.




Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Russell Street Report Website Design by D3Corp Ocean City Maryland