12 Scray facts about the US debt.

**AirFlacco** · 02-18-2012, 07:49 PM

Oh and Galen - the fact that price of gold more than doubled shows how

much the dollar has weakened. Maybe not to you but it does to the rest of the world. An ounce gold is an ounce of gold and if gold is 100 and goes to 200 an ounce, all it means is the dollar has weakened..

And here's some reasons why gold is still good to get. It's
still the preferred currency around the world and everyone wants it and
paper currency is heading to distruction. Just ask the Euro.

Hey Galen - tell your wife to take all her gold jewelry to the mall to see
what it's worth. One gal im the link got $1,000 for a neckless and ring.

Some more reasons to buy gold:

http://dailyreckoning.com/is-gold-still-a-buy/

**AirFlacco** · 02-19-2012, 08:13 PM

Speaking of scary debt, dig this.

Ever wonder where all that TARP $$ went to? The banks you say? Part right.
That $700B ballooned up to over $12T and don't forget, the FEd is private
so the share holders like the Rockefellers, Rothchilds, Goldman Sacs get
the interest the printing generates. There's nothing backing the funny
money.

Bloomberg followed the money
trail but was stonewalled when the Fed Reserve refused to disclose. It's
our money but the Fed is private so Bloomberg sued.

They won in the lower court but it was appealed and looked who was
is listed in the appeal document supporting the Fed. All the banks that got tarp $$.

Keep in mind, printing money usually creates debt because it's not backed.
We don't have $12T in gold to back it, just $261B in gold. Kennedy tried
to kill the Fed Reserve with an executive order and then print new $2
bills that would be backed by silver which would have somewhat relieved a depressed economy and he wanted to pull everyone out of
Vietnam by end of 1965.

Five months after signing the order to kill the Fed he was killed. Reagan
was shot after he tried to keep a campaign promise of streamlining
the gov't as he tried to streamline it. Someone even tried to shoot
Andy Jackson after he killed the National Bank by letting it's charter
expire in the 1835. Lawrence told doctors later his reasons for the shooting. He blamed Jackson for the loss of his job. He claimed that with the President dead, "money would be more plenty" (a reference to Jackson's struggle with the Bank of the United States) and that he "could not rise until the President fell."

But here, the Fed REserve won't disclose their documents and it's our
money.

Scary stuff here and kudos to Bloomberg. Again, the two things that
drive up debt is printing of money and wars.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/need-to-know...-bailout/3309/

**Greg** · 02-20-2012, 08:59 AM

We have monetized our debt and decreased confidence in the dollar to the point that many countries no longer use it as their reserve currency for trading. There will be, and probably soon, a lynch pin event which will cause the dollar to start to fall and like a snowball going down hill the momentum will be hard to stop. Given the amount of dollars just created out of thin air under Greenspan and accelerated under Bernanke as we deficit spend and he finances it with magical new dollars, the fall will probably be steep and hard.

The good news, you might be able to pay off your mortgage with your weekly paycheck!

The bad news, no government, not one, that has ever had this happen has survived. Not one.

So yes, Galen, this is a very dangerous game our politicians are playing with those running the Fed. And like the previous point, not once has it worked.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-20-2012, 11:41 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

We have monetized our debt and decreased confidence in the dollar to the point that many countries no longer use it as their reserve currency for trading. There will be, and probably soon, a lynch pin event which will cause the dollar to start to fall and like a snowball going down hill the momentum will be hard to stop. Given the amount of dollars just created out of thin air under Greenspan and accelerated under Bernanke as we deficit spend and he finances it with magical new dollars, the fall will probably be steep and hard.

The good news, you might be able to pay off your mortgage with your weekly paycheck!

The bad news, no government, not one, that has ever had this happen has survived. Not one.

So yes, Galen, this is a very dangerous game our politicians are playing with those running the Fed. And like the previous point, not once has it worked.

Actually it has worked and worked without inflation. and you doomsday scenario makes its exciting for amygdala-based thinkers but really the scary deficit stuff is losing its steam. People are starting to catch on that deficits never seem to matter when Republicans are in office but suddenly everything must stop when a Democrat comes in to once again fix the mess the Republicans cause. Something about a 13000 DOW also makes me question the confidence factor.

**Greg** · 02-21-2012, 04:33 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

Actually it has worked and worked without inflation. and you doomsday scenario makes its exciting for amygdala-based thinkers but really the scary deficit stuff is losing its steam. People are starting to catch on that deficits never seem to matter when Republicans are in office but suddenly everything must stop when a Democrat comes in to once again fix the mess the Republicans cause. Something about a 13000 DOW also makes me question the confidence factor.

I have always contended that deficits matter. That liberal-lites that have been Republicans disagree means nothing more to me than you disagreeing. Keynes was wrong and so are these dunderheads.

I posted in many of these forums my many disappointments with Bush, including his very reckless spending.

We are not experiencing severe inflation now (which conveniently leaves out food and energy) because the dollar is still held as the world's reserve currency. When it is not we will experience inflation. We already are, the government is just fudging the numbers by not counting necessities like those mentioned because they are a problem.

Why do you think so many investors are buying gold right now?

Your opening sentence is not supported by one fact listed.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-21-2012, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

Your opening sentence is not supported by one fact listed.

Inflation has remained steady throughout this whole recession. The only price inflation occuring is around oil and products affected by high oil prices such as food. This is obviously occuring because of the uncertainty around Iran not because of the national economy. To include those in standard inflation measures would be highly misleading and miss the point of why it is important to measure inflation.

**AirFlacco** · 02-21-2012, 05:32 PM

Wrong facts by Galen again.

He must have skipped the exact increases
in food prices posted above and as both Greg and I pointed out above, oil and food prices are conveniently left out of the inflation equation.

They come out of the consumer price
index (CPI).

That $382B in interest we pay out for the debt might have something to do with inflation also-lol.

Galen was somewhat correct about unrest
in Iran's part of the world but oil prices have
been climbing long before that due to the
supply and demand coming not only from
us but the emerging economies of India
and China where billions suddenly stopped riding bikes and bought cars.

And all that from Galen's king in the
White House.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/white-...asoline-prices

**Greg** · 02-23-2012, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

Inflation has remained steady throughout this whole recession. The only price inflation occuring is around oil and products affected by high oil prices such as food. This is obviously occuring because of the uncertainty around Iran not because of the national economy. To include those in standard inflation measures would be highly misleading and miss the point of why it is important to measure inflation.

So gold has not gone up, or silver, or copper, or . . .

To not include food and energy is misleading.

Obama is purposely causing the price of energy to rise, he is forcing coal plants out of business, stopping us from exploring for oil in our country and stopping no brainers like the Keystone XL pipeline. It should be counted because it hits all of our wallets.

**Galen Sevinne** · 02-24-2012, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Greg

So gold has not gone up, or silver, or copper, or . . .

To not include food and energy is misleading.

Obama is purposely causing the price of energy to rise, he is forcing coal plants out of business, stopping us from exploring for oil in our country and stopping no brainers like the Keystone XL pipeline. It should be counted because it hits all of our wallets.

Gold has gone down in the last six months. Truly I think gold has hit unprecedented highs because of the mass marketing going on channels like Fox that are painting doomsday scenarios and that gold is the solution. Now that most indicators point to a recovering economy gold will star going down as it has for the last 6 month period.

One can include gas prices in inflation because it does affect our wallets but one also has to recognize that gas prices going up aren't a result of Obama's economic policies nor his energy policies. Domestic drilling is at an all time high:

U.S. net petroleum imports have fallen to about 47% of the nation's consumption, down from a record 60.3% in 2005, Energy Information Administration statistics show. It's been 15 years since the nation's reliance on foreign oil has been this low.

Several factors figure into the import decline, but a big one is a little surprising: U.S. petroleum exploration is experiencing a quiet renaissance with the help of technology and new drilling techniques.

The number of oil rigs in production in the U.S. has reached a 24-year high, according to oil field services company Baker Hughes. In 2005, domestic production was 1.89 billion barrels. This year, experts say, production is expected to surpass 2 billion barrels.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/oct...-boom-20111029

The Keystone Pipeline has nothing to do it with and is only being used as a conservative leverage point against Obama. Even Transcanada admits their current pipelines are underutilized.

**NCRAVEN** · 02-24-2012, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

One can include gas prices in inflation because it does affect our wallets but one also has to recognize that gas prices going up aren't a result of Obama's economic policies nor his energy policies. Domestic drilling is at an all time high:
.

I was going to type a reply, but there is no need:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...rofile_oneline

Another suspect—one Mr. Obama doesn't like to mention—is U.S. monetary policy. Oil is traded in dollars, and its price therefore rises when the value of the dollar falls, all else being equal. The Federal Reserve throughout Mr. Obama's term has pursued the easiest monetary policy in modern times, expressly to revive the housing market. It has done so with the private support and urging of the White House and through Mr. Obama's appointees who are now a majority on the Fed's Board of Governors.

Earlier in the thread you said this

Also the government is NOT spending and borrowing at record amounts and what they are borrowing and spending will slow down as companies start spending money again. It is not having nearly the effect the conservative base would want you to believe

Spending money we do not have, forcing us to borrow from the Fed has a huge affect.

**NCRAVEN** · 03-02-2012, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by Galen Sevinne

GM is adding shifts and reporting record sales

Whoops...
http://campaign2012.washingtonexamin...t-sales/406771

**Greg** · 03-02-2012, 03:49 PM

One can include gas prices in inflation because it does affect our wallets but one also has to recognize that gas prices going up aren't a result of Obama's economic policies nor his energy policies. Domestic drilling is at an all time high:

U.S. net petroleum imports have fallen to about 47% of the nation's consumption, down from a record 60.3% in 2005, Energy Information Administration statistics show. It's been 15 years since the nation's reliance on foreign oil has been this low.

LOL, you know, when we were discussin ANWAR the liberals were telling us how it would take at least 5 years after permits were issued to get that oil.

They were right. We would have that oil now, and the oil being pumped now is because of Bush's policies, not Obama's. These permits were issue 5 and more years ago.

**NCRAVEN** · 03-02-2012, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by Greg

LOL, you know, when we were discussin ANWAR the liberals were telling us how it would take at least 5 years after permits were issued to get that oil.

They were right. We would have that oil now, and the oil being pumped now is because of Bush's policies, not Obama's. These permits were issue 5 and more years ago.

Not to mention, a lot of the oil production we're getting now is from drilling on private land (North Dakota anyone?). Not oil permits the government approved. Facts, they're some crazy sh*t.