Grubbs Contingency Plan - Evan Mathis?

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-17-2012, 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by wickedsolo

He's also older than dirt and has contemplated retirement for the past couple of years. I actually think the Bengals had to coax him out of retiring last off-season.

I agree that he is old...but dude can play and has played well recently. I would prefer him for 1 year and getting a young guy ready for next year to picking up Jake Scott for multiple years.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-17-2012, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by wickedsolo

Oh here's a though...hey Michael Oher...play guard.

Bam.

I think that's a good idea, but I don't think they are ready to admit that Oher may be a failure at OT.

**Tyrian** · 03-17-2012, 03:05 PM

Jake Scott's had one visit to the Cardinals, not sure of any others.

Schwartz has a few teams after him, including Vikings and Chiefs. Ravens would need to act fast if they want to try.

Nothing on Bobbie Williams, but Cincy may try to bring him back.

Chilo Rachal was not good at all last year. Don't think any visits.

Robert Galley, Kyle Kosier and former Raven Jason Brown could be other possibilities for FA.

**GOTA** · 03-17-2012, 03:15 PM

I'd still check out Vernon Carey. He's a very good run blocker and 6'6 340. If Birk is going to be the Center having a real road grader next to him is worth considering.

**GOTA** · 03-17-2012, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

I agree that he is old...but dude can play and has played well recently. I would prefer him for 1 year and getting a young guy ready for next year to picking up Jake Scott for multiple years.

Mckinnie, Williams and Birk might be the oldest left side in the history of the NFL.

**bmorecareful** · 03-17-2012, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by Tyrian

Jake Scott's had one visit to the Cardinals, not sure of any others.

Schwartz has a few teams after him, including Vikings and Chiefs. Ravens would need to act fast if they want to try.

Nothing on Bobbie Williams, but Cincy may try to bring him back.

Chilo Rachal was not good at all last year. Don't think any visits.

Robert Galley, Kyle Kosier and former Raven Jason Brown could be other possibilities for FA.

Scott is serviceable, but a poor run blocker. With him at LG and Birk back at C, we would probably be even worse in short yardage this year, particularly if they don't upgrade at power RB.

Gallery, Kosier, and Brown are all bad players. Rachal had a bad year last year, but was pretty good in 2010 and is younger than those guys. He's a possibility.

Bobbie Williams was the best player on that list last year, and worth a 1 year deal, IMO. Schwartz would also be a good pick up.

Bottom line here is that missing out on Mathis, particularly when the Eagles locked him up at such a low price, is devastating and a real head-scratcher. Unless he gave the Eagles a huge hometown discount, I don't understand why Ozzie didn't get it done.

**Carey** · 03-17-2012, 03:18 PM

Do you now take a pure guard higher then a center? maybe if they can get get gurode back for depth at center they can hold off a year. I also like the idea of going after Bobbie Williams as well. Im hoping for alot of movement draft day because we need to fill these holes w/adequate replacements.

**Carey** · 03-17-2012, 03:20 PM

Oh btw, i dont have Coirdy Glenn getting to 29 but if he did that would be sweet

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-17-2012, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by GOTA

I'd still check out Vernon Carey. He's a very good run blocker and 6'6 340. If Birk is going to be the Center having a real road grader next to him is worth considering.

Certainly someone to look into, but does he mesh with the zone blocking we seem to be trying to go to?

**TTRaven** · 03-17-2012, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

Scott is serviceable, but a poor run blocker. With him at LG and Birk back at C, we would probably be even worse in short yardage this year, particularly if they don't upgrade at power RB.

Gallery, Kosier, and Brown are all bad players. Rachal had a bad year last year, but was pretty good in 2010 and is younger than those guys. He's a possibility.

Bobbie Williams was the best player on that list last year, and worth a 1 year deal, IMO. Schwartz would also be a good pick up.

Bottom line here is that missing out on Mathis, particularly when the Eagles locked him up at such a low price, is devastating and a real head-scratcher. Unless he gave the Eagles a huge hometown discount, I don't understand why Ozzie didn't get it done.

We don't have the cap space.

**bmorecareful** · 03-17-2012, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by GOTA

I'd still check out Vernon Carey. He's a very good run blocker and 6'6 340. If Birk is going to be the Center having a real road grader next to him is worth considering.

Carey doesn't seem to fit the scheme at all, but he could work if nothing else is available.

**Tyrian** · 03-17-2012, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by GOTA

I'd still check out Vernon Carey. He's a very good run blocker and 6'6 340. If Birk is going to be the Center having a real road grader next to him is worth considering.

He usually plays tackle, but it's an option. Also helps that he knows McKinnie from the U.

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

Scott is serviceable, but a poor run blocker. With him at LG and Birk back at C, we would probably be even worse in short yardage this year, particularly if they don't upgrade at power RB.

Gallery, Kosier, and Brown are all bad players. Rachal had a bad year last year, but was pretty good in 2010 and is younger than those guys. He's a possibility.

Bobbie Williams was the best player on that list last year, and worth a 1 year deal, IMO. Schwartz would also be a good pick up.

Bottom line here is that missing out on Mathis, particularly when the Eagles locked him up at such a low price, is devastating and a real head-scratcher. Unless he gave the Eagles a huge hometown discount, I don't understand why Ozzie didn't get it done.

Right player, right price. The Ravens are up against the wall with the cap with important extensions ahead and they didn't want to pay more than 25 million for Mathis. I can't say I fault them - I thought 24-26 would be about their limit.

If there isn't much out there, rather they just draft a G or a C (that starts as a G) and go for the sink or swim. Still a couple of options worth thinking about for now.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-17-2012, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

Bottom line here is that missing out on Mathis, particularly when the Eagles locked him up at such a low price, is devastating and a real head-scratcher. Unless he gave the Eagles a huge hometown discount, I don't understand why Ozzie didn't get it done.

Good grief...WE DON'T HAVE THE CAP SPACE

FYI...for those of you that continue to complain about losing players, here are the cap numbers from PFT as of Thursday...

Broncos: $40.0 million.
Bengals: $38.9 million.
Seahawks: $28.6 million.
Titans: $26.2 million.
Jaguars: $24.8 million.
49ers: $23.5 million.
Eagles: $22.3 million.
Bills: $22.2 million.
Browns: $21.6 million.
Chiefs: $21.4 million.
Buccaneers: $17.9 million.
Vikings: $18.8 million.
Rams: $14.6 million.
Chargers: $14.5 million.
Dolphins: $14.3 million.
Colts: $14.3 million.
Patriots: $13.6 million.
Lions: $13.3 million.
Bears: $12.8 million.
Jets: $12.7 million.
Redskins: $11.3 million.
Texans: $8.7 million.
Packers: $7.2 million.
Falcons: $6.0 million.
Steelers: $5.8 million.
Cowboys: $5.5 million.
Raiders: $5.0 million.
Ravens: $4.7 million.
Panthers: $3.1 million.
Saints: $3.0 million.
Giants: $2.3 million.
Cardinals: $448,000.

As you can see, WE DON'T HAVE THE CAP ROOM. It's like some just don't want to acknowledge that cap space is really tight.

**GOTA** · 03-17-2012, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

Carey doesn't seem to fit the scheme at all, but he could work if nothing else is available.

No he's not a smaller, athletic player but neither is McKinnie. One thing for sure you put Carey next to McKinnie and you will run over defenses. Ray Rice would be in heaven.

**GOTA** · 03-17-2012, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by Tyrian

He usually plays tackle, but it's an option. Also helps that he knows McKinnie from the U.

They moved him to RG last season and he looked a lot more comfortable.

**bmorecareful** · 03-17-2012, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by TTRaven

We don't have the cap space.

No, that's not true. The Ravens have at least 7.7m in space as of this moment, and they haven't really used any of the many tricks available to them to expand their space yet. If they extend Flacco and/or Rice, that likely frees up a lot of room, and they can restructure a few contracts. They could easily open up another 10m of cap space if they needed it at this point, and eventually they'll need to if they want to make this team better.

The exact details of Mathis' contract aren't out yet, but in the first year of a new contract teams almost always minimize the cap hit with a big signing bonus. The Ravens probably could have locked Mathis up and only taken a 2012 cap hit of 2-4m on a similar contract to the 5/25 that he actually signed. That's a negligible cap hit for the best OL on the market.

**GOTA** · 03-17-2012, 03:29 PM

Here's another thought. The Eagles just spent a lot money for 2 Guards. They did draft a Guard in round 1 last year. Maybe they'd be willing to get out of his contract for 5th round pick. Watkins is already 27. He's very talented but Howard Mudd plays a tough system and a lot of guys just don't fit in it. If I was Ozzie I would at least make a call.

**Tyrian** · 03-17-2012, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by bmorecareful

No, that's not true. The Ravens have at least 7.7m in space as of this moment, and they haven't really used any of the many tricks available to them to expand their space yet. If they extend Flacco and/or Rice, that likely frees up a lot of room, and they can restructure a few contracts. They could easily open up another 10m of cap space if they needed it at this point, and eventually they'll need to if they want to make this team better.

The exact details of Mathis' contract aren't out yet, but in the first year of a new contract teams almost always minimize the cap hit with a big signing bonus. The Ravens probably could have locked Mathis up and only taken a 2012 cap hit of 2-4m on a similar contract to the 5/25 that he actually signed. That's a negligible cap hit for the best OL on the market.

7.7m probably went down to 4.7 with Birk's re-signing.

Aaron Wilson ‏ @RavensInsider Close
@SeeToShiningSee Likely averages $2.5 to $3 million annually on that one, but no official numbers on Matt's deal

**Tyrian** · 03-17-2012, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by GOTA

Here's another thought. The Eagles just spent a lot money for 2 Guards. They did draft a Guard in round 1 last year. Maybe they'd be willing to get out of his contract for 5th round pick. Watkins is already 27. He's very talented but Howard Mudd plays a tough system and a lot of guys just don't fit in it. If I was Ozzie I would at least make a call.

Watkins was that 1st rounder from last year despite his age.

**bmorecareful** · 03-17-2012, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by Tyrian

7.7m probably went down to 4.7 with Birk's re-signing.

Aaron Wilson ‏ @RavensInsider Close
@SeeToShiningSee Likely averages $2.5 to $3 million annually on that one, but no official numbers on Matt's deal

Yeah, the numbers I looked at probably didn't include that. Still, they can restructure any one of half a dozen players to open up more space, and they know they have the Flacco deal on the horizon to open up space as well.

If the team doesn't have any space and isn't going to sign anyone, why did they even make Mathis an offer? Why bother with FA at all? That argument is senseless.