NFL Guards - Do'h Not Panic

**purplepoe** · 03-18-2012, 04:33 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

What about the Bears in 2011 who made the NFC Championship with perhaps the WORST line in the NFL that year?

Cut the ignorance out about Gurode, once again you fail to realize that Gurode is a god damn center not a guard. Do you actually think playing Birk at left guard would have been any different? Gurode may well be bought back, you don't know that yet, Gurode had a great season in 2010 at center for the Cowboys too, ranked 6th out of all NFL centers too. Believe me, if the Ravens don't bring him back, a team will sign him as a starting C next season, my moneys on the Cowboys getting him back.

Cut the ignorance?

How about you cut the rhetoric.

Gurode and Birk were FAs.

Birk got a deal from the Ravens, Gurode didn't. Gurode is younger and hasn't had multiple injuries over the past year. Edit: I forgot Gurode's knee was an issue last summer. Yet he's sitting out there and Birk is signed.

How about you connect the dots a bit before calling someone's take ignorant.

I don't fail to realize anything.

Gurode had some experience playing guard while Birk never has. I take that back. I fail to realize why that's even being brought up.

I guess we'll see if Gurode is signed to start at Center for a team.

PP

**pickles** · 03-18-2012, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

What 2 guys who shouldn't have been in the league?

Not to mention 12th HIGHEST in QB Hits, 16th in power rating to the left(thats exactly half), 17th up the gut, and 13th right.

How can sit there and act like the numbers somehow support what you're saying?

Every number you provided says the Ravens had a fairly average offensive line last year, and not this horror show you're trying to make it out to be.

I think alot of people support making the OL a priority of improvment- I know I do- but that doesn't mean I'm going to try and twist facts and act like last years line was some abortion either, when it clearly wasn't.

**leachisabeast** · 03-18-2012, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by purplepoe

Cut the ignorance?

How about you cut the rhetoric.

Gurode and Birk were FAs.

Birk got a deal from the Ravens, Gurode didn't. Gurode is younger and hasn't had multiple injuries over the past year. Yet he's sitting out there and Birk is signed.

How about you connect the dots a bit before calling someone's take ignorant.

I don't fail to realize anything.

Gurode had some experience playing guard while Birk never has. I take that back. I don't fail to realize why that's even being brought up.

I guess we'll see if Gurode is signed to start at Center for a team.

PP

Yes and Gurode was historically known for being poor at guard, and was swiftly moved back to C when he had a few games there in 2006 for the Cowboys. Birk is more familiar with the Ravens and the system it runs, that is probably the main reason he was re signed and Gurode wasn't, plus Harbaugh seems to love him and has a lot to do with who goes and who comes back (see Cam Cameron.)

**pickles** · 03-18-2012, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

Yes and Gurode was historically known for being poor at guard, and was swiftly moved back to C when he had a few games there in 2006 for the Cowboys. Birk is more familiar with the Ravens and the system it runs, that is probably the main reason he was re signed and Gurode wasn't, plus Harbaugh seems to love him and has a lot to do with who goes and who comes back (see Cam Cameron.)

The fact still remains that we had a fairly average line last year even w two guys who had no buisness playing G starting for half the year.

**leachisabeast** · 03-18-2012, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by pickles

The fact still remains that we had a fairly average line last year even w two guys who had no buisness playing G starting for half the year.

Yeah it was average all year, you wont hear any argument from me regarding that. Yanda had a great season, Leach had a great season, Grubbs had a good season, the rest of the line where average or below average. Our tight ends also struggle to block too.

**pslholder96** · 03-18-2012, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Jsmoove

assuming they didn't sign Mckinney or draft/sign a REAL LT.

Mckinney tweeted the other day that he met with the coaches after his weigh in that he was coming back. The ravens will pick up his $500,000 roster bonus. So that question has already been answered.

**JustaslowZ06** · 03-18-2012, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by pickles

How can sit there and act like the numbers somehow support what you're saying?

Every number you provided says the Ravens had a fairly average offensive line last year, and not this horror show you're trying to make it out to be.

I think alot of people support making the OL a priority of improvment- I know I do- but that doesn't mean I'm going to try and twist facts and act like last years line was some abortion either, when it clearly wasn't.

Um we gave up the 12th most hits, ys you can point the finger at the WR's if you'd like. We also were middle of the pack in power ratings. If "average" is ok by you than thats your opinion. Mine is I'd like our line to be better.

**purplepoe** · 03-18-2012, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

Um we gave up the 12th most hits, ys you can point the finger at the WR's if you'd like. We also were middle of the pack in power ratings. If "average" is ok by you than thats your opinion. Mine is I'd like our line to be better.

Once again, nobody is saying the status quo is ok. It's an ongoing thing here. Some people have refuted the notion that the OL was "bad" which has been repeated over and over by some.

All we are saying is that it wasn't bad or terrible. It was serviceable. Average if you will.

I doubt you'll find anyone on this board or around town who doesn't think improving the OL is something the team needs to do.

There's a big difference in that opinion and saying last year's OL was bad.

PP

**pickles** · 03-18-2012, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

Um we gave up the 12th most hits, ys you can point the finger at the WR's if you'd like. We also were middle of the pack in power ratings. If "average" is ok by you than thats your opinion. Mine is I'd like our line to be better.

Originally Posted by purplepoe

Once again, nobody is saying the status quo is ok. It's an ongoing thing here. Some people have refuted the notion that the OL was "bad" which has been repeated over and over by some.

All we are saying is that it wasn't bad or terrible. It was serviceable. Average if you will.

I doubt you'll find anyone on this board or around town who doesn't think improving the OL is something the team needs to do.

There's a big difference in that opinion and saying last year's OL was bad.

PP

Ding, ding, ding, ding! Exactly.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-18-2012, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

Um we gave up the 12th most hits, ys you can point the finger at the WR's if you'd like. We also were middle of the pack in power ratings. If "average" is ok by you than thats your opinion. Mine is I'd like our line to be better.

Who gives a crap about some power rankings.

Of all RB's that had over 200 carries only 5 averaged more than he did.

Despite what everybody wants to call the best OL in the league, he still averaged .3 ypc more than the great Arian Foster.

If you want to make Ray Rice and Ricky Williams out to be Tecmo Bowl Bo Jackson, then fine...nobody but you ignores the fact that we did a solid/good job running the ball last year.

BTW, I'd like EVERY position on this team to be better...including the OL. I just live in a reality that when your RB is the second leading rusher in the league, your OL is not BAD

And yes, I along with everybody else would like an improvement, however, when you don't have much cap room, there is only but so much you can do. And sometimes the guy you have is better than the guy you pick up off the street.

**The Excellector** · 03-18-2012, 05:24 PM

The line wasn't terrible. There are plenty of teams that would be glad to have the Ravens offensive line. The only issue with Birk is that he might be able to hold up for an entire season, which is why you draft Philip Blake. The entire line played bad against Houston. They had been playing well, up to that point. Rice was finally breaking bigger runs, because he was showing more patience. Another example of his occasional lack thereof was in the Divisional Round playoff game versus Houston. If he'd followed Yanda, he would have been in. However, he was quick to cut and got stopped short.

If McKinnie stays in shape, he'll do. If they prepare Blake behind Birk, the C position will do. Yanda will do at RG and if they keep Oher in one spot, he'll do.

Now comes LG. They could make it an open competition. Justin Boren can compete with Jah Reid, or Reid can compete with Oher at RT. Either Reid proves himself to be the best at one spot or loses out to Boren and Oher.

I somewhat agree with GOTA in that, although there have been plenty of successful mid-late round picks at G, that does not mean they started out playing great. Marshal Yanda did start the vast majority of his rookie season, but he was not playing nearly as well then as he is now.

However, this just may be a situation where you have to open the competition and take a chance.

**JustaslowZ06** · 03-18-2012, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

Who gives a crap about some power rankings.

Of all RB's that had over 200 carries only 5 averaged more than he did.

Despite what everybody wants to call the best OL in the league, he still averaged .3 ypc more than the great Arian Foster.

If you want to make Ray Rice and Ricky Williams out to be Tecmo Bowl Bo Jackson, then fine...nobody but you ignores the fact that we did a solid/good job running the ball last year.

BTW, I'd like EVERY position on this team to be better...including the OL. I just live in a reality that when your RB is the second leading rusher in the league, your OL is not BAD

And yes, I along with everybody else would like an improvement, however, when you don't have much cap room, there is only but so much you can do. And sometimes the guy you have is better than the guy you pick up off the street.

And that wasn't on RR? And noone but me huh? Done with this convo. You have nothing to back up anything you say.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-18-2012, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

And that wasn't on RR? And noone but me huh? Done with this convo. You have nothing to back up anything you say.

Wow. I think we are done here.

**JustaslowZ06** · 03-18-2012, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by Raveninwoodlawn

Wow. I think we are done here.

Yeah pretty much, you think we had a great line or something just because RR had good numbers. You look at the OL as the reason for this and RR being the product. I see it the other way around. Oh and BTW so does Filmstudy and his OL rankings posts. You think Gurode won't be in the league this year, where as I'll bet you my next paycheck he's on someone else's roster at least as a backup. The Cowboys cut him for their own reasons, sorry but I'm not going to put much faith in Jerry Jones and that FO to set the bar for a players effectiveness. And last but not least you like injecting your smartass little snide attitude into it when we were having a perfectly acceptable debate.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-18-2012, 06:09 PM

Anyway, after a pretty funny debate with a guy who said our line was "bad" and backed it up with some power rankings that showed it was NOT "bad" but average and apparently didn't read any of my posts where I gave more than enough stats to back up my argument, I agree that we should bring in some competition for that RG or LG spot to compete with Reid.

But I don't think we should be so quick to dismiss or panic at him playing there...based on what the coaches and media reports about him during last years camp, Dude showed he could play in the league even if he wasn't ready yet to start at RT.

Let's get some competition, give him a chance and draft an OL or 2 to compete in the interior.

Like we've pointed out, we lost SEVEN starters on our roster last year...SEVEN, yet we were better this past year than the year before.

**leachisabeast** · 03-18-2012, 06:13 PM

Anyone who thinks Rice's success was due to our line is deluded. So a lineman can run down 40 yards and block for Rice?

**leachisabeast** · 03-18-2012, 06:14 PM

Or how about linemen breaking tackles FOR RICE aye? (Granted this was 2009, point still stands though)

**purplepoe** · 03-18-2012, 06:14 PM

It's a whole lot more fun to debate a topic when the people you are debating with actually read what you write and don't constantly put words in your mouth.

When someone posts something, respond to what they say, not what you think they are saying. And if you aren't clear, freakin ask before typing.

PP

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 03-18-2012, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by JustaslowZ06

Yeah pretty much, you think we had a great line or something just because RR had good numbers. You look at the OL as the reason for this and RR being the product. I see it the other way around. Oh and BTW so does Filmstudy and his OL rankings posts. You think Gurode won't be in the league this year, where as I'll bet you my next paycheck he's on someone else's roster at least as a backup. The Cowboys cut him for their own reasons, sorry but I'm not going to put much faith in Jerry Jones and that FO to set the bar for a players effectiveness. And last but not least you like injecting your smartass little snide attitude into it when we were having a perfectly acceptable debate.

I mean you want to keep going that's fine. I not only pointed out Ray Rice's stats, but we also had another RB who put up more than acceptable numbers. I pointed out that ypc. I pointed out that we had the second leading rusher in the league, but you want to put that ALL on Ray Rice? Maybe you need to rewatch the SoundFX on the 49er game when the coaches had to keep telling Rice to stay on track and stop being impatient with the cut backs. So no it wasn't just Ray Rice turning into 2003 Jamal Lewis...we had a backup that somehow was more than acceptable behind this "bad" OL. We had a bad OL in 2010. We did not in 2011. That's a fact.

Maybe your desire to have a great OL makes you look at an OL that is average or slightly above and turn them into the horrible unit who couldn't block it's way out of a paper bag.