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  1. #73
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?



    Quote Originally Posted by vinny600 View Post
    Everyone keeps saying the Ravens offered Rice a deal similar to Foster's. Arnie_uk suggested it may have been this guy (thanks Arnie) but I can't find any reference to that. I've seen him say that the Foster deal "could be a good comparison for Rice negotiations", but not that the Ravens actually offered him that.

    Ray Rice deserves at least what Foster got, and he cannot risk getting hurt while playing under the tag. He may play this year under it but I would be shocked if he played next year under it.

    If the Ravens did offer him Foster money that's one thing, but if they didn't than they are low balling him and he has every right to do what's best for himself and his family. I think he knows that the Ravens are a billion dollar enterprise, and he has already played for way less than he's worth. Hell he could have pulled a Chris Johnson and demanded more money last year but he played out his contract and now he deserves to get paid.
    Actually, Tony is the one who alluded to the Ravens offering Rice a contract similar to what Foster got. He doesn't have any substantial proof on that, just what he's been told by his sources and I've no reason to doubt him.
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  2. #74

    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    I remember reading that he was offered a contract like fosters but at this point like I said before the is no reason to accept it. There is no sense of urgeny on either side as July 15 is 3 months away. I do believe they get a deal done as rice said he does not want to play under the tag but will. No need to get a deal done now. Let's get flacco done then when July 1 comes along we can bring back the rice talks. It won't happen till then because no one will budge until there is a sense of urgency. The only way it happens before July 15 is if he accepts the deal foster got which RIGHT NOW I don't think he will do. That may change in July.




  3. #75
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by Benny8444 View Post
    I remember reading that he was offered a contract like fosters but at this point like I said before the is no reason to accept it. There is no sense of urgeny on either side as July 15 is 3 months away. I do believe they get a deal done as rice said he does not want to play under the tag but will. No need to get a deal done now. Let's get flacco done then when July 1 comes along we can bring back the rice talks. It won't happen till then because no one will budge until there is a sense of urgency. The only way it happens before July 15 is if he accepts the deal foster got which RIGHT NOW I don't think he will do. That may change in July.
    The thing is even if he signs the Franchise Tag that doesn't stop them from continuing to iron out a long term deal, which would replace the tag and it's implications.
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  4. #76
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    ... It is reasonable to think that with a better offensive line and better receivers, Double-A or even a rookie RB could provide enough of a running game to make the offense as productive.
    I never liked that argument, because you can always say...WR "A" would have greater stats if he had a better QB throwing to him; CB "B" would have more INTs if his team had a better pass-rush; QB "C" would have improved stats if he had a better Oline; etc. IMO Ray Rice is a STAR quality player that AA or a rookie RB cannot replace IF a team has Super Bowl aspirations like the Ravens do... Bc




  5. #77
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    I never liked that argument, because you can always say...WR "A" would have greater stats if he had a better QB throwing to him; CB "B" would have more INTs if his team had a better pass-rush; QB "C" would have improved stats if he had a better Oline; etc. IMO Ray Rice is a STAR quality player that AA or a rookie RB cannot replace IF a team has Super Bowl aspirations like the Ravens do... Bc
    That is definitely not an outlandish opinion either and I do agree to a point. The goal, IMO, is to not only win the SB this year...but win multiple SB's over the course of several years and potentially putting future cap in jeopardy for any player is not a great business plan from my perspective.

    Overall, my point was that this team's SB aspirations are going to live and die with Flacco, not Ray Rice.
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  6. #78
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    That is definitely not an outlandish opinion either and I do agree to a point. The goal, IMO, is to not only win the SB this year...but win multiple SB's over the course of several years and potentially putting future cap in jeopardy for any player is not a great business plan from my perspective.

    Overall, my point was that this team's SB aspirations are going to live and die with Flacco, not Ray Rice.
    While I see your point, and agree with most of it, I just don't think any old RB can come in and replace Rice's production (even with better WRs and Oline). I wouldn't "break the bank" for Rice, but let's not down-play what he brings to the Ravens offense either... Bc




  7. #79
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    While I see your point, and agree with most of it, I just don't think any old RB can come in and replace Rice's production (even with better WRs and Oline). I wouldn't "break the bank" for Rice, but let's not down-play what he brings to the Ravens offense either... Bc
    I don't think that I'm downplaying him at all. If anything, I think it speaks to what he brings to the table when I stated that you could potentially have 2 guys replicate what Rice did (meaning Double-A + Berry or someone else).

    I think even towards the first couple pages of this specific thread Shas and I were discussing the actual amount of "value" that Rice brings to the table versus what Foster brings to Houston. When it's all said and done, both guys brought approximately 35% of the offense to their respective teams. That is a ridiculous thing when you think about it and replacing it or coming close to replicating it is not an easy feat at all, but the Ravens wouldn't be the first team to go that route IF they chose to do so.
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  8. #80
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    I don't think that I'm downplaying him at all. If anything, I think it speaks to what he brings to the table when I stated that you could potentially have 2 guys replicate what Rice did (meaning Double-A + Berry or someone else).

    I think even towards the first couple pages of this specific thread Shas and I were discussing the actual amount of "value" that Rice brings to the table versus what Foster brings to Houston. When it's all said and done, both guys brought approximately 35% of the offense to their respective teams. That is a ridiculous thing when you think about it and replacing it or coming close to replicating it is not an easy feat at all, but the Ravens wouldn't be the first team to go that route IF they chose to do so.
    Nobody wants to over-pay for something, be it a used car or a fixer-upper house. I just like resigning players (Webb is a great example) when they are entering their most productive years. I wouldn't resign Ed Reed to a high contract, but IMO Rice (and Flacco when his time comes) deserve it. I'm glad the Ravens used the Franchise Tag on Rice because we know he'll be with us in 2012. Sorry to repeat, but I think you (and others) diminish the RB position a bit due to the rules that aid the passing game. I just don't agree with that belief... Bc




  9. #81

    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by wickedsolo View Post
    The thing is even if he signs the Franchise Tag that doesn't stop them from continuing to iron out a long term deal, which would replace the tag and it's implications.
    He wont sign the tag right now as that would require him to attend all workouts and at his position that is a BIG risk for injury. Why risk injury when you can work out on your own and keep in touch with coaches and teammates. There is no point in him signing anything until July. If he signs his tag and gets hurt in OTAs or camp his value goes down big time. That is why he would hold out till the end of camp. He is one of the players who can stay in shape and work out on his own. Plus once camp is over there is still 3.5 weeks of practice before the season starts and chances are he would report by then wheather it be as the franchise player or under a new contract.




  10. #82

    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    Quote Originally Posted by lovefootball View Post
    If Rice holds out, next, man up!Rice did well against most teams, but had problems against the teams we needed to beat.Can't claim to be all that when he couldn't make a big difference in the pats game. Pick up those first downs when it mattered the most and the Ravens go to the SB the last several years.
    Agreed. Plus, lest not forget Rices last 3 playoff games he wasn't good. His fumble in Puttsburgh took the momentum away from the Ravens 2 years ago. For over 10 years now the Ravens have run the ball well regardless of who carries the ball. I wouldn't be that surprised to see the Ravens draft a back in the 2nd round especially if they find a trade partner to trade with if our first rounder of choice is gone. Drafting a RB early will save lots of cash the next 4 years to acquire other peices. RB's who can't get 3-4th and short behind 2 probowl G's and an ALL PRo FB aren't worth 8 million, IMO. Like to see the look on Rices face if the Ravens draft a RB early. He won't get even close to Foster $ after that from anyone, including the Ravens. We didn't hear Webb botching about his contract for statistically being the 2nd best corner behind Revis. Webb is way more important than Rice and so is Flacco. Hope Ravens give Joe 1 more legit pass target.




  11. #83

    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    The reality is that everyone is going to get hit with a surprise if he does. That surprise will be that the Ravens offense will not go down the drain without him.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




  12. #84
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    Re: Does anyone think Ray Rice could hold out?

    I love how everyone is saying things like "next man up!", but this is RB we're talking about, you can kind of survive if your ILB or even one of your starting DE's goes down, but I'd like to see you guys say that if Rice really does hold out/or gets injured. We would be starting an unproven 7th round drafted player who has little experience in the NFL, or even a pro style offense (unless we draft someone, or sign a RB on the market who would probably be no one big since we have next to no cap space.)

    I'm pretty sure our offense would implode, this could end up being a serious matter. The best thing to do is draft a RB in the 3rd round IMO, I really really do like Bernard Pierce, tremendous break away speed. If we don't get Rice signed long term in 2012, I think we'd be better off trading him for a high draft pick, and could then go in with Pierce as our new RB if he where to pan out. The only major downside about him is his health, he has a bad history of injuries.




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