This really erked me this weekend...

[wickedsolo]

My wife and I traveled over to the Eastern Shore to visit my Mom for Easter and while over there I noticed that the guy who used to live across the street was no longer there and his house was in foreclosure. I asked my Mom what was going on there, because he has a landscaping company and mowed her yard, etc. She told me that this dude just got tired of having a mortgage. He wasn't upside down or anything. He just didn't want to pay his mortgage anymore, so he moved out, stripped the house of the nice crown molding trim, copper, appliances, etc.

Last week he came over to do some work for my Mom and he was driving a brand new $60,000 full size truck and was gloating about the fact that because he didn't have to pay his mortgage anymore he could get a new truck.

He's a typical "local" in some of those towns on the Eastern Shore that are big fish in little ponds. Grew up there, never left, knows everyone, etc.

I think that's absolutely disgusting. Makes me sick that there are honest and hardworking folks who can't get a mortgage to buy a house and there are shit heads like this guy.

[Galen Sevinne]

My wife and I traveled over to the Eastern Shore to visit my Mom for Easter and while over there I noticed that the guy who used to live across the street was no longer there and his house was in foreclosure. I asked my Mom what was going on there, because he has a landscaping company and mowed her yard, etc. She told me that this dude just got tired of having a mortgage. He wasn't upside down or anything. He just didn't want to pay his mortgage anymore, so he moved out, stripped the house of the nice crown molding trim, copper, appliances, etc.

Last week he came over to do some work for my Mom and he was driving a brand new $60,000 full size truck and was gloating about the fact that because he didn't have to pay his mortgage anymore he could get a new truck.

He's a typical "local" in some of those towns on the Eastern Shore that are big fish in little ponds. Grew up there, never left, knows everyone, etc.

I think that's absolutely disgusting. Makes me sick that there are honest and hardworking folks who can't get a mortgage to buy a house and there are shit heads like this guy.

He is the perfect example why the government needs to be involved in individual activities that affect other people. Now your mom's property will lose value at least temporarily while everyone living nearby this freeloader absorbs his irresponsibility. We had a guy buy in our neighborhood right across the street from us who could afford his mortgage for about 6 months and then he rented the house for several years. Finally someone bought his house and has brought it back to community standards. Fortunately, we weren't looking to sell during those years so it didn't impact us.

There are areas that need strict regulation so the repsonsible folks aren't absorbing the irresponsible folks risk. Health care via mandate is a perfect example as well as how one qualifies to mortgage a home.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[wickedsolo]

I always figured that if you were foreclosing on a house, you had to prove you couldn't afford it anymore and essentially declare bankruptcy or close to it.

Seems to me that considering a mortgage is a contract between a lender and yourself, if you DONT pay it because you don't feel like it the lender should be able to file a lawsuit against you for breach of contract.

[AirFlacco]

I hear copper is a big thing. Thieves are ripping them off of houses
and breaking inside to get them. Junkyards are paying a lot for them.

New truck? I'd hate to see his credit report.

[wickedsolo]

I hear copper is a big thing. Thieves are ripping them off of houses
and breaking inside to get them. Junkyards are paying a lot for them.

New truck? I'd hate to see his credit report.

When I was at my remote duty station a few years ago there were a group of guys who'd drive around the area and dig up the copper electrical wire, cut sections out of it out (cutting off electricity to our base and other areas) and then sell it.

Regarding his new truck, his credit report isn't the point...how is it that someone can afford to continue their mortgage...choose to NOT pay it because he just didn't "feel" like it...and then go out a few weeks later and finance a brand new truck?

How the hell does that work?

[JStruds]

When I was at my remote duty station a few years ago there were a group of guys who'd drive around the area and dig up the copper electrical wire, cut sections out of it out (cutting off electricity to our base and other areas) and then sell it.

Regarding his new truck, his credit report isn't the point...how is it that someone can afford to continue their mortgage...choose to NOT pay it because he just didn't "feel" like it...and then go out a few weeks later and finance a brand new truck?

How the hell does that work?

Maybe he got the truck before the bad credit started to kick in. If there's any justice, once it does kick in, it will prevent him from gaining loans for personal use and for his business.

[NCRAVEN]

I always figured that if you were foreclosing on a house, you had to prove you couldn't afford it anymore and essentially declare bankruptcy or close to it.

Seems to me that considering a mortgage is a contract between a lender and yourself, if you DONT pay it because you don't feel like it the lender should be able to file a lawsuit against you for breach of contract.

I believe the contract is relatively simple in that as far as if you don't pay the bank owns it. I am almost certain if the bank takes the house back, sells and it and doesn't pay off the loan they come after you for the rest or at least it's listed as a collection.

[wickedsolo]

I believe the contract is relatively simple in that as far as if you don't pay the bank owns it. I am almost certain if the bank takes the house back, sells and it and doesn't pay off the loan they come after you for the rest or at least it's listed as a collection.

Maybe, but it still seems pretty crappy that this guy has no financial hardships at all and just decides to split because he doesn't want the house anymore. After stripping the house of the trim work, some hardwood from the flooring, copper, appliances, fixtures, etc, the house isn't anywhere near the value that it should or could be.

I don't necessarily feel that the government should have a hand in this, but I do think that if there are guys like this (because I can't honestly think that he is the ONLY one to have done this during the housing crisis) then the banks should go after them because they're fucking the system purposely.

I mean, I've JUST been able to get a new car because of my student loans have weighed me down for so many years.

It's just incredible to me that there are guys like this who are more than willing to add to an already jacked up system and continue to add to the mess for everyone else to clean up.

No offense to a lot of the good people on the Eastern Shore, but there is a significant amount of this kind of mentality over there and I can't stand it. Couldn't wait to leave there and am glad I don't ever have to go back.

[NCRAVEN]

I don't disagree it's crappy. The guy is a jackass, no doubt.

I think the banks should modify their contracts if they are unhappy with the current outcomes. THat would seem to be the most logical and easiest fix.

Question what part of the Eastern Shore are you from?

[NCRAVEN]

He is the perfect example why the government needs to be involved in individual activities that affect other people.

Yes the Government needs to make laws and get involved in each individuals life because the actions of a select few idiots.

[HoustonRaven]

I have a friend back in Baltimore who did a 30 year ARM right toward the end of the bubble. Her rate tripled after the housing bubble blew up and the bank was not willing to refinance to a fixed rate mortgage. It was cheaper for her to do a planned buy back than it was for her to go through bankruptcy. She actually ended up renting the house from the bank once the bank took the house over.

She'd be the first to tell you it was her fault she got into that mess.

Wicked -- since you were in the Navy, you need to take advantage of the VA loans you can get once you decide to buy. All but one of my houses were done via the VA and I have a low rate fixed rate of 3.45% on my current home.

[The Fanatic]

I have a friend back in Baltimore who did a 30 year ARM right toward the end of the bubble.

I've never understood why anybody would do an ARM on anything.

It's like gambling with your life.

I guess the appeal is the very low interest rate to suck you in, but to think that the rate won't change because the current (at the time) economic climate is so good is insane to me.

I've always been someone that wanted to know exactly or pretty damn close to what my payment was going to be for the duration of a loan I have taken out.
I don't like surprises at all!!

Even with a fixed rate loan there are still fluctuations due to taxes, insurances. etc. that cause increases due to escrow (sp?) shortages, etc., but nothing that is devastating the way a lot of those loans were that got so many people in trouble.

I'm no economic guru, but I have enough common sense and basic math skills to understand that "fixed" means it ain't changing, and "adjustable" means it can change at anytime.
Problem is/was a lot of people I suppose didn't understand that.

Stuff like this is the type of skill that I'm referring to when I and somebody else in another thread spoke about classes or courses being required in high school of basic skills and understanding of how to function in life.

[JStruds]

I've never understood why anybody would do an ARM on anything.

It's like gambling with your life.

I guess the appeal is the very low interest rate to suck you in, but to think that the rate won't change because the current (at the time) economic climate is so good is insane to me.

I've always been someone that wanted to know exactly or pretty damn close to what my payment was going to be for the duration of a loan I have taken out.
I don't like surprises at all!!

Even with a fixed rate loan there are still fluctuations due to taxes, insurances. etc. that cause increases due to escrow (sp?) shortages, etc., but nothing that is devastating the way a lot of those loans were that got so many people in trouble.

I'm no economic guru, but I have enough common sense and basic math skills to understand that "fixed" means it ain't changing, and "adjustable" means it can change at anytime.
Problem is/was a lot of people I suppose didn't understand that.

Stuff like this is the type of skill that I'm referring to when I and somebody else in another thread spoke about classes or courses being required in high school of basic skills and understanding of how to function in life.

ARMs were beneficial to house flippers and speculators to whom housing was an investment, not a home. Then, greed took over and the initial low interest rate was used as a selling tactic aimed at the more gullible among us.

[Galen Sevinne]

The review of the housing problem in this thread is typical "blame the minorities" coded racist innuedo, conservative bluster. It is no different than the previous threads that blame Democrats for poverty in this country because they stick up for the poor. Meanwhile statistics show the extreme wealthy getting richer and everyone from middle class - down becoming poorer; yet, its the democrats enabling the poor by restributing the wealth? huh? One has to say.

It is easy to debunk the bluster in this thread that allowing and even encouring people other than whites to buy houses was a huge mistake. Of course, no on this thread will admit that this is really beneath their language but as soon as they start blaming the government and using words like "minorities" the point is expresed.

The CRA was in 1977 opening up more lending to minorities because previous to 1977, certain area in cities, known as "redlining", were off-limits to lending for houses. Areas that fell within the "redlines" were predominately black so banks wouldn't loan money for houses to be purchased in these areas. Clearly this policy was racist in intent. In 1977, CRA denied this practice. Did the housing bubble occur as soon as blacks started buyiing houses? Nope.

The housing bubble began around 2000 NOT 1977. So what happened in 2000? Well, in 1999 three Republican Senators co-sponsored authored the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act which repealed part of the Glass–Steagall Act of 1933. Glass Steagall limited commercial bank securities activities and affiliations between commercial banks and securities firms. In other words, Glass-Steagall prevented banks and securities firms from bundling mortgages which would disperse the risk asssociated with bad loans away from banks. The passing of the Republican Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act now opened up a "handshake" between lending banks and Wall Street. As a result, banks had less skin in the game while security firms passed bundled loans around making millions off the transactions. The Gramm-Leachy-Bliley Act was passed by a Republican House and a Republican Senate as well as signed off by Bill Clinton.

The housing crash has little to do with lending to minorities or else this crash would have occurred shortly after 1977. It has everyhting to do with the repeal of Glass-Steagall. Bill Clinton has a hand in it as well as the Republican controlled congress of 1999. Fannie and Freddie had their role as well but none of this woulf have occurred with the repeal of Glass-Steagall and it has nothing to do with the Community Reinvestment Act of 1977.

The ensuing bubble encouraged greedy Americans to buy more house than they could afford. It encouraged greedy Americans to refinace and pull unprecedented amount of money out their newly found "equity" and buy shit they don't need which ultimately led to them being unable to afford their upside down homes.

Now that I am back in town, I need to go through and correct all the misinformation that is running rampant.

[AirFlacco]

Misinformation?

Hey Galen, you just repeated what I said above about Clinton and the Fannies and Freddies.

No one mentioned OBYs baby. Acorn, planting the seeds to disaster.


http://www.nationalreview.com/articl.../stanley-kurtz

[NCRAVEN]

The review of the housing problem in this thread is typical "blame the minorities" coded racist innuedo, conservative bluster.

Care to point to what you're talking about?

[The Fanatic]

Somebody on here mentioned in another thread about needing schools to have classes and courses about the basic skills needed to survive life, handle credit, etc.
This situation is a perfect example of that notion.

Stuff like this is the type of skill that I'm referring to when I and somebody else in another thread spoke about classes or courses being required in high school of basic skills and understanding of how to function in life.

Well apparently this type of thing does exist in some places after all.
It should be in every high school in every state IMO.

Does The Math Add Up?

"Many educators and school officials are recognizing the need to send students out into the world with the ability to maintain their personal finances. There are currently four states — Missouri, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia — that have instituted a mandatory one semester class related to personal finance. In Virginia, freshmen are required to take the course as part of their graduation requirements. Granted, a one-semester class is not going to teach a student everything they need to know about personal finance, but at least they are introduced to the basic concepts, which is a good start."

[HoustonRaven]

Largest class of people effected by the housing bubble bust? Whites.

But hey, why should that get in the way of Galen and his race baiting?

[Galen Sevinne]

Largest class of people effected by the housing bubble bust? Whites.

But hey, why should that get in the way of Galen and his race baiting?

And where did I suggest that whites weren't the most "effected"(sic)?

Nice projection though. It reinforces the structure of my argument that conservative are mostly interested in making the housing crisis a race issue. My premise is that the deregulation of the banking/securties market is the cause while your premise is the open lending to minorities caused the crisis. Sure you try to couch it in this language of it not really being about minorities but more about government making it easier for minorities that caused the problem but your language continues to be coded (whether you are aware of it or not) with innuedos of race. When I blame the problem on the stripping of a government regulation that had been around for 70 years effectively regulating the mortgage business then all of a sudden, I am "race baiting". How does that exactly work? Projection my friend. You want this to be about race so you call it out as soon as you can with no mention of race on my part. Interesting.

You might want to check your projection as the truth of the matter is that we are all influenced by race. It is our projections that give us hints of our own racial prejudgements and it becomes our responsibility to learn from them. That is, if we want to be as least affected by race as possible.

[wickedsolo]

And where did I suggest that whites weren't the most "effected"(sic)?

Nice projection though. It reinforces the structure of my argument that conservative are mostly interested in making the housing crisis a race issue. My premise is that the deregulation of the banking/securties market is the cause while your premise is the open lending to minorities caused the crisis. Sure you try to couch it in this language of it not really being about minorities but more about government making it easier for minorities that caused the problem but your language continues to be coded (whether you are aware of it or not) with innuedos of race. When I blame the problem on the stripping of a government regulation that had been around for 70 years effectively regulating the mortgage business then all of a sudden, I am "race baiting". How does that exactly work? Projection my friend. You want this to be about race so you call it out as soon as you can with no mention of race on my part. Interesting.

You might want to check your projection as the truth of the matter is that we are all influenced by race. It is our projections that give us hints of our own racial prejudgements and it becomes our responsibility to learn from them. That is, if we want to be as least affected by race as possible.

It's not even the conservatives making this a race issue...the entire government made it a race issue way back when they determined that banks obviously were discriminatory against minorities and needed a law to allow families to take out mortgages regardless of whether or not they could truly afford it.

Frankly, anyone lending money should be discriminatory. Otherwise how do you ensure that you can get that money back?