How Courtney Upshaw compares to Lamar Woodley

**seraph** · 04-29-2012, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by ActualSpamBot

Anticipation? You mean like the ability to get into the backfield and disrupt the play? Boy... I bet they have some way of keeping track of that. Oh I know, how about a guy who has around 100 tackles, and nearly 50 of them take place behind the line of scrimmage (32 tackles for loss and 17.5 sacks against SEC offensive lines.)

Good thing I was talking about the pass rush. I hope Upshaw leads the league in stuffs.

**Boulderraven** · 04-29-2012, 03:52 PM

That is the most common comparison. Both are similar, Upshaw is more thought to have a higher football IQ. Upshaw was rated the higher prospect. I see them used in the same way. That's why most mocks had Upshaw as a top 20 pick. Saban would not steer Ozzie wrong, both Bama guys and Brown ties. The Ravens got a very good all around breathe day in day out football player in Upshaw. Arm length is one of the dumbest evaluators of a player. It's about smarts, power, moves and making good reads. The game is mostly mental.

**GOTA** · 04-29-2012, 03:53 PM

I don't really see Woodley either. Calvin Pace is who Upshaw reminds me of. And you know what? Pace is pretty damn good player.

**The Excellector** · 04-29-2012, 03:57 PM

The young man was the most dominant pass rusher, in the most dominant conference, on the most dominant defense I've seen in years, coached by a guy who provides pro ready talent.

What more does this young man need to do?

**ActualSpamBot** · 04-29-2012, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by seraph

Good thing I was talking about the pass rush. I hope Upshaw leads the league in stuffs.

Read better I broke it down between stuffs and sacks. Dude had 16.5 sacks in 30 SEC games. Not sure how having the second most sacks in the SEC is evidence of not being able to rush the passer. Especially because he's going to be our secondary pass rusher.

**ActualSpamBot** · 04-29-2012, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

What more does this young man need to do?

Jump 9 inches further in the broad jump. Obviously that would be much more indicative of pass rushing ability than a dominate college career.

**seraph** · 04-29-2012, 04:10 PM

Upshaw is a good fit for the scheme. As a secondary pass rusher who gets effort sacks and clean up sacks he would be fine for 6-8 sacks. I don't think that makes the defense better than it already is which is still good. At least Woodley can become the guy for the Steelers. If Suggs starts declining I don't think Upshaw can be relied on as a dominant pass rusher.

**leachisabeast** · 04-29-2012, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by ActualSpamBot

Jump 9 inches further in the broad jump. Obviously that would be much more indicative of pass rushing ability than a dominate college career.

Yeah because Upshaw is going to have to leap for a bunch of imaginary hoops on the field right?

Seriously, I don't get how people can complain about the Upshaw pick, you trade back into the second and get a guy many teams had as a mid first rounder on their boards, but dropped because his arms aren't long enough for teams standards everyone decides to pass on him. The Patriots are going to regret taking Hightower over Upshaw IMO, along with Barron, it was Upshaw who was the difference maker on that defense. Loving the Osemele and Pierce picks too. Pierce I think is going to be a star, just not many people know it yet, he has heaps of talent. That one cut move he does is epic.

**bmorecareful** · 04-29-2012, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by seraph

Upshaw is a good fit for the scheme. As a secondary pass rusher who gets effort sacks and clean up sacks he would be fine for 6-8 sacks. I don't think that makes the defense better than it already is which is still good. At least Woodley can become the guy for the Steelers. If Suggs starts declining I don't think Upshaw can be relied on as a dominant pass rusher.

Conversely, one could make the argument that because Woodley is not "the guy" for the Steelers (James Harrison is,) he benefits from the single blocks he's facing when his counterpart is double-teamed. Upshaw was pretty much the sole every-down pass-rush threat Alabama had, although they blitzed very well. He didn't have the luxury of a strong pass-rush threat on the other side taking attention off of him.

Upshaw won't be "the guy" for the Ravens, as you say. With Suggs being the primary threat teams are game-planning for, Upshaw could be even more productive for the Ravens than he was for Alabama.

I don't know that Upshaw could replace Suggs at this point in time, but if he were to go down, we would still have 2 viable pass-rushing OLBs on the roster with Kruger probably taking over the weak-side rusher role. Kruger was technically listed as Suggs' backup last year anyway, and I feel good about Kruger and Upshaw if Suggs were to go down. Bottom line, I feel good about any lineup that has 2 of those 3 OLBs.

**TheJoeFlaccoShow** · 04-29-2012, 06:39 PM

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2012cupshaw.php

Player Comparison: LaMarr Woodley. Upshaw's game is similar to Woodley (6-2, 265) or Ravens outside linebacker Terrell Suggs. Like them, Upshaw's strength is pass rushing off the edge. Upshaw may not be as good athletically at dropping into coverage like those two Pro Bowlers. As an edge rusher, He could turn into a pro who has a similar impact as Woodley or Suggs.

**wickedsolo** · 04-29-2012, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by TheJoeFlaccoShow

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2012cupshaw.php

I sure hope so.

I hope he comes ready to roll and plays with a massive chip on his shoulder.

**TheJoeFlaccoShow** · 04-29-2012, 07:33 PM

Originally Posted by wickedsolo

I sure hope so.

I hope he comes ready to roll and plays with a massive chip on his shoulder.

Same here.

That report also mentions having him get to about 260-265 to improve his coverage ability, which I think is a good idea.

272 is just a bit heavy I think for that position especially at only 6'2. Hopefully with a stepped up fitness and eating regime that comes with being a "professional" with the means to do all that and the proper instruction, he can get to about 265 with a much better body composition. He looks very thick in his lower half and that is all where his power comes from, and he won't lose much down there by cutting his BF down a little bit.

From everything I have been reading about him I am thrilled with the pick especially at 35.

Here is one of the most detailed scouting reports I have seen on him.....

http://nfldraftmonsters.com/scouting...urtney-upshaw/

Pretty much the only knock is his coverage ability, not because he has shown he can't do it but because he was rarely asked to do it at Alabama. They wanted him near the line as much as possible because that is where he does his most damage. But think about this, how many times did we have Jarrett Johnson dropping into coverage? Not much that I can remember.

**JAB1985** · 04-29-2012, 07:37 PM

Watching him i dobt see woodley. Measureables do seem comparable but i dont half the pass rusher woodly was coming out. Im rooting for the kid but i think people have unrealistic hopes for him. I really dont see him being much more than depth. His main pass rush was bull rushing in college, and those sacks arent impressive even in the sec to be called the best pass rusher, in the nfl hes not going to get away with that. Hes not that good of a pass rusher and thatll take time. Not saying he cant but not being a quick twitch and seeing how he played i highly doubt we see a huge jump this year in ability.

**TheJoeFlaccoShow** · 04-29-2012, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

Watching him i dobt see woodley. Measureables do seem comparable but i dont half the pass rusher woodly was coming out. Im rooting for the kid but i think people have unrealistic hopes for him. I really dont see him being much more than depth. His main pass rush was bull rushing in college, and those sacks arent impressive even in the sec to be called the best pass rusher, in the nfl hes not going to get away with that. Hes not that good of a pass rusher and thatll take time. Not saying he cant but not being a quick twitch and seeing how he played i highly doubt we see a huge jump this year in ability.

If Woodley was this devastating pass rusher coming out that Upshaw isn't, then why did that not translate on the field playing against weaker competition? Why in the world did he fall to the 46th overall pick?

Woodley had 18 sacks his last 2 years as a full time starter, Upshaw had 16.5.

Woodley had 30.5 tackles for a loss, while Upshaw had 32.5

**ballhawk** · 04-29-2012, 08:39 PM

Thanks for the links JFS. Its is hard not to get excited about Upshaw. Ozzie has been trying for years to find that pass rushing threat opposite Suggs. Kruger /kindle aren't it...maybe Upshaw is. The Championship pedigree is enticing and the guy seems like a natural leader. At the least, we should get JJ 2.0. at best, we get our own pair of elite pass rushers to contend with the pair up in pitt. Im glad they invested another top pick into the D.

**bmorecareful** · 04-29-2012, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

Watching him i dobt see woodley. Measureables do seem comparable but i dont half the pass rusher woodly was coming out. Im rooting for the kid but i think people have unrealistic hopes for him. I really dont see him being much more than depth. His main pass rush was bull rushing in college, and those sacks arent impressive even in the sec to be called the best pass rusher, in the nfl hes not going to get away with that. Hes not that good of a pass rusher and thatll take time. Not saying he cant but not being a quick twitch and seeing how he played i highly doubt we see a huge jump this year in ability.

How is bull rushing a future NFL OT to the ground for a sack "less impressive" than just running past a guy untouched (which was a lot of what guys like Shea McClellin did?) I'm just not following this line of thought. It's ridiculous.

If you guys want Vernon Gholston and Aaron Maybin, go ahead and pine away over those kind of guys. The type of college pass rusher that is most likely to bust in the NFL is the freak of nature guys who can run forward so fast and jump up so high in shorts. They get to the NFL expecting to run straight past everyone, then guys get their hands on them and hit them and hurt them and shove them on their pansy asses. Those guys bust, okay?

Upshaw's not going to bust because he puts his hands on people and pushes them out of the way and gets violent with them. He imposes his will. I watched almost all of Alabama's games, and he was beating up on future NFL caliber talent all day long. Why do people think that what Upshaw did on Saturdays isn't going to have anything to do with what he'll be able to do on Sundays?

**houstonravensfan** · 04-29-2012, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

The young man was the most dominant pass rusher, in the most dominant conference, on the most dominant defense I've seen in years, coached by a guy who provides pro ready talent.

What more does this young man need to do?

+1. All he needs to do is play like a Raven. He might not be great, but he'll be at least good.

**blacknpurplepain** · 04-29-2012, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by Boulderraven

That is the most common comparison. Both are similar, Upshaw is more thought to have a higher football IQ. Upshaw was rated the higher prospect. I see them used in the same way. That's why most mocks had Upshaw as a top 20 pick. Saban would not steer Ozzie wrong, both Bama guys and Brown ties. The Ravens got a very good all around breathe day in day out football player in Upshaw. Arm length is one of the dumbest evaluators of a player. It's about smarts, power, moves and making good reads. The game is mostly mental.

I totally agree!!!!! I believe Upshaw will do big things as a Raven. I Believe this was a great draft that might produce several starters next year and I think the biggest surprise is going to be the Running back out of Temple.

**leachisabeast** · 04-30-2012, 05:11 AM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

Watching him i dobt see woodley. Measureables do seem comparable but i dont half the pass rusher woodly was coming out. Im rooting for the kid but i think people have unrealistic hopes for him. I really dont see him being much more than depth. His main pass rush was bull rushing in college, and those sacks arent impressive even in the sec to be called the best pass rusher, in the nfl hes not going to get away with that. Hes not that good of a pass rusher and thatll take time. Not saying he cant but not being a quick twitch and seeing how he played i highly doubt we see a huge jump this year in ability.

And people say things like this every year about prospects coming out of college. Lets just watch how he does in the NFL first before drawing judgement on him. From what I seen, he was the most explosive pass pusher in the toughest conference in college football, playing for one of the best defenses in college history. He is certainly going to stuff the run behind the line of scrimmage for us, and he is going to rush the passer better than what JJ could for us. He went up against future NFL left tackles and dominated them, he went up against next years top rated left tackle in practice every week. I'm pretty sure he will do fine for us, he is so good at defending the run, I could see them putting him at the jack LB position next to Ray Lewis.

**Terpsfan82** · 04-30-2012, 06:26 AM

When I watch him he reminds me of former Steeler Levon Kirkland. He's not quite as big but he plays with that same level of violence. I like that. He will be better than JJ by next season.