Upshaw might not be starter

**iggyman555** · 08-21-2012, 03:28 PM

McClellan looked good

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...urtney-upshaw/

**BigPlayReceiver** · 08-21-2012, 03:37 PM

Upshaw hasn't proven that he should be a starter.

**Benny8444** · 08-21-2012, 03:43 PM

Just because he was our #1 pick does not make him a starter right away even with the Suggs injury. He has to earn it. There are many defensive players who are taken in the first round who dont start right away and have to wait their turn.

He has been slowed by his shoulder after looking like a beast in OTAs. Give him time to heal. Also the Ravens want him around 270ish to play OLB in our 3-4. if he is pratcing that means he is getting better because they wont let him practice if his shoulder was still bad. Its just healing has he is playing.

Suggs did not start right away his rookie year... and he was a top 10 pick

**GOTA** · 08-21-2012, 03:44 PM

Upshaw has a ways to go. I'm not even sure he's in the shape they want him to be in coming in heavy and then getting injured. He'll start eventually but that doesn't mean it should be game 1.

**Bhcforlife** · 08-21-2012, 03:59 PM

Not starting could be the best thing for him right now, as well as the team. He can rotate in like Suggs did his first year, providing a fresh body on third downs that they are going to need with guys like Kruger and McPhee transitioning into starting roles.

**JAB1985** · 08-21-2012, 05:07 PM

I said he wasnt going to start the day he got drafted... But suggs wasnt hurt then so this is somewhat surprising. He could have easily filled in the JJ role but youre not handed anything in this world and hes not done anything to earn it.

Originally Posted by GOTA

Upshaw has a ways to go. I'm not even sure he's in the shape they want him to be in coming in heavy and then getting injured. He'll start eventually but that doesn't mean it should be game 1.

Kind of sad isnt it? Thats the one thing you always heard about him. Nobody questioned his work ethic or his heart (playing through injuries), yet both are somewhat in question since we drafted him.

**leachisabeast** · 08-21-2012, 05:12 PM

He is likely to rotate with Albert McClellin this year. McClellin has packed on a ton of muscle, he looks jacked up right now. I do think that Upshaw will become a starter eventually, but it's extremely rare for rookies (even from programmes like Alabama) to come into this complex defensive scheme and start right away. The last time that happened was when Haloti Ngata was drafted which was like six years ago, and even before then, and other than Ngata and Ray lewis, I can't think of any rookie who's started right away on this defense. Suggs didn't even start right away, and he was a top 10 pick.

I think McClellin actually has a future as the next jack/will LB once Ray Lewis retires, which will mean McClain moves to the Mike LB position.

**The Excellector** · 08-21-2012, 05:34 PM

I don't think his work ethic is the question. It is his lack of knowledge, of how to manage his body at the NFL level. The guy is naturally strong and naturally big. You don't just show up to a professional league with that type of knowledge. Suggs didn't and neither did Haloti Ngata. it takes time to figure that out. The issue is not that he is out of shape. It is that he is around his college playing weight and the coaching staff wants him at a different one. He is still in shape though.

**BcRaven** · 08-21-2012, 05:46 PM

OK, so say that Kruger and McClellan start (with Upshaw and Kindle as back-ups).
Then later in the season, Suggs and Upshaw step-up. Seems like that would be a very strong set of OLBs going into the playoffs. Agree? ... Bc

**The Excellector** · 08-21-2012, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by BcRaven

OK, so say that Kruger and McClellan start (with Upshaw and Kindle as back-ups).
Then later in the season, Suggs and Upshaw step-up. Seems like that would be a very strong set of OLBs going into the playoffs. Agree? ... Bc

A fresh rotation at that.

**Ravenswintitle** · 08-21-2012, 07:36 PM

Might be best to play him situationally for a few games for a lot of reasons

**Jayc00** · 08-21-2012, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by Ravenswintitle

Might be best to play him situationally for a few games for a lot of reasons

Agreed.

Would like to eventually see him starting, but as long as we get production and sacks I don't care who starts really.

**wickedsolo** · 08-21-2012, 09:17 PM

He's too heavy. He needs to drop some weight and play around 260-265. Not 275ish. He isnt a quick twitch guy anyway. Strong as hell, but he doesnt have quick feet and burst, so playing at a lighter weight could really be beneficial for him.

**Benny8444** · 08-21-2012, 09:26 PM

With his body and size 265-270 should be about right. He played about 280-285 at Bama and for LBs and DL there is always a transition in playing weight from College to Pros. He is in great shape, just not at the weight that would make him a star in our system but time will fix that. His injury is already healing, now its just about getting to the weight the coaches want and getting reps.

**leachisabeast** · 08-22-2012, 02:16 AM

Thing is, no one could stop him in college, he was too strong for tackles, even in the SEC conference. He just can't get away with that in the NFL, he needs to get more explosive off the edge to make a difference, otherwise he's just never going to be a great pass rusher.

**JAB1985** · 08-22-2012, 05:01 AM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

I don't think his work ethic is the question. It is his lack of knowledge, of how to manage his body at the NFL level. The guy is naturally strong and naturally big. You don't just show up to a professional league with that type of knowledge. Suggs didn't and neither did Haloti Ngata. it takes time to figure that out. The issue is not that he is out of shape. It is that he is around his college playing weight and the coaching staff wants him at a different one. He is still in shape though.

he ballooned up in between the combine and his pro day, and only recently got down to what his playing weight at college was, which is about 9 lbs heavier than the team aants him at. Thats the questions i have, it shouldnt have taken him that long to get back.down to where he was used to being. The extra 10, yeah i can see your point but he should have never ballooned up to begin with. It was an odd move at the time and apparently its still effecting him by getting where the team wants him.

**leachisabeast** · 08-22-2012, 05:18 AM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

he ballooned up in between the combine and his pro day, and only recently got down to what his playing weight at college was, which is about 9 lbs heavier than the team aants him at. Thats the questions i have, it shouldnt have taken him that long to get back.down to where he was used to being. The extra 10, yeah i can see your point but he should have never ballooned up to begin with. It was an odd move at the time and apparently its still effecting him by getting where the team wants him.

I too have some questions my self. I mean he was the MVP in the BCS bowl and recorded like two sacks. You kind of expect him to at least have some explosion off the edge, and yes it's just one game, but he didn't look explosive at all in the Lions game, he was pretty good at bullrushing though.

Upshaw hasn't been known for work ethic issues, and getting lazy, especially coming from a team like Alabama. So my guess is that he thought he had to report to camp as big as he could get, but failed to realise that you really don't have to be that big to be a pass rusher in this league nowadays.

**wickedsolo** · 08-22-2012, 05:46 AM

The thing with Upshaw is that he is a thick dude. He's got huge arms, chest, and shoulders...he's built like a 6'2" tank.

He probably carries a lot of water weight naturally since he has so much dense muscle mass.

**JAB1985** · 08-22-2012, 06:08 AM

Originally Posted by leachisabeast

I too have some questions my self. I mean he was the MVP in the BCS bowl and recorded like two sacks. You kind of expect him to at least have some explosion off the edge, and yes it's just one game, but he didn't look explosive at all in the Lions game, he was pretty good at bullrushing though.

Upshaw hasn't been known for work ethic issues, and getting lazy, especially coming from a team like Alabama. So my guess is that he thought he had to report to camp as big as he could get, but failed to realise that you really don't have to be that big to be a pass rusher in this league nowadays.

Seeing him on tape that was my biggest issue with the guy. his pass rushing repertoire was pretty basic, really all he did was bull rush. he out muscled guys effectively in college, but that just isnt going to happen in the NFL. Hes not quick twitch like Wicked, Myself and others have noted so he really needs to work on techniques. not saying it wont happen, but this year i think hes going to be very average at best. the weight loss will help in that area as well as being a little lighter on his feet in coverage. He should do well against the run, and i think thats the role he should have on this team.

Im not trying to say the guy isnt trying or doesnt have heart, not my intention. Im just saying those were unquestionable things coming out, but now it at least raises a debate on whether or not he does for those reasons.

**wickedsolo** · 08-22-2012, 06:17 AM

Originally Posted by JAB1985

Seeing him on tape that was my biggest issue with the guy. his pass rushing repertoire was pretty basic, really all he did was bull rush. he out muscled guys effectively in college, but that just isnt going to happen in the NFL. Hes not quick twitch like Wicked, Myself and others have noted so he really needs to work on techniques. not saying it wont happen, but this year i think hes going to be very average at best. the weight loss will help in that area as well as being a little lighter on his feet in coverage. He should do well against the run, and i think thats the role he should have on this team.

Im not trying to say the guy isnt trying or doesnt have heart, not my intention. Im just saying those were unquestionable things coming out, but now it at least raises a debate on whether or not he does for those reasons.

Exactly and honestly, it'll come working with guys like Suggs and Kruger because I'd argue that those guys aren't exactly "quick twitch" athletes either.

When I say quick twitch I'm talking about guys like McPhee, Freeney, JJ Watt, Brooks Reed...those guys just have an initial burst and 1st step that is hard to match up against. They're already in motion before the offensive lineman is even out of his stance.