The Maurice Jones- Drew situation

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 07:44 AM

I understand that this topic may very well find it's way to the 'Non-Ravens' portion of the board, but I feel that this topic makes for a very intriguing debate.

It seems that we have an older RB, who has defied the numbers and is still leading the league in rushing, but who also sees the new trend of the league. Even with that in mind, given the recent deals to well known RBs, what Jones-Drew is being paid to lead the league in rushing on a team destined to go nowhere, is a significant discount.

Jones Drew wants his last major payday and that is understandable. He isn't the first and he won't be the last. However, not only has Jacksonville taken a hard stance, but a disrespectful one. Particularly, with comments made by their new owner Mr. Khan.

There was even a report that Jones-Drew was nearing arrival to camp, when he heard those comments from Khan and changed his mind.

On one hand, Jones-Drew is the leader of that team. However, Michael Irvin made a good point in that this could send a bad message to the younger players on the team. In essence, if this is the way that you talk about him and treat him, what are you going to do to me when my time comes up?

Now, I know that we have some guys who simply take exception to players arguing over millions of dollars. However, what I think we need to accept is that they are arguing over their worth and, based on the money they bring in for the league, they are pretty close to it. We also speak as if the owners would simply take that excess money and do something more constructive with it when, deep down, we all know that not to be true. They happen to be in good spots for a lucrative business. We aren't. That doesn't mean they should automatically take what we'd take, because of our own desperation.

We all know what that team is going to ask Jones Drew to do. They are going to ask him to carry the ball thirty times a game and run him into the ground. We know it, the team knows it and Jones Drew knows it. What he is essentially saying, I think, is that you can't tell me that my position is devalued one day, but ask me to be such a high percentage of the offense at the same time. You can't have it both ways.

Personally, I think the element of being on a losing team has come into play here as well.

What do you guys think about the overall situation?

**JAB1985** · 08-23-2012, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

I understand that this topic may very well find it's way to the 'Non-Ravens' portion of the board, but I feel that this topic makes for a very intriguing debate.

It seems that we have an older RB, who has defied the numbers and is still leading the league in rushing, but who also sees the new trend of the league. Even with that in mind, given the recent deals to well known RBs, what Jones-Drew is being paid to lead the league in rushing on a team destined to go nowhere, is a significant discount.

Jones Drew wants his last major payday and that is understandable. He isn't the first and he won't be the last. However, not only has Jacksonville taken a hard stance, but a disrespectful one. Particularly, with comments made by their new owner Mr. Khan.

There was even a report that Jones-Drew was nearing arrival to camp, when he heard those comments from Khan and changed his mind.

On one hand, Jones-Drew is the leader of that team. However, Michael Irvin made a good point in that this could send a bad message to the younger players on the team. In essence, if this is the way that you talk about him and treat him, what are you going to do to me when my time comes up?

Now, I know that we have some guys who simply take exception to players arguing over millions of dollars. However, what I think we need to accept is that they are arguing over their worth and, based on the money they bring in for the league, they are pretty close to it. We also speak as if the owners would simply take that excess money and do something more constructive with it when, deep down, we all know that not to be true. They happen to be in good spots for a lucrative business. We aren't. That doesn't mean they should automatically take what we'd take, because of our own desperation.

We all know what that team is going to ask Jones Drew to do. They are going to ask him to carry the ball thirty times a game and run him into the ground. We know it, the team knows it and Jones Drew knows it. What he is essentially saying, I think, is that you can't tell me that my position is devalued one day, but ask me to be such a high percentage of the offense at the same time. You can't have it both ways.

Personally, I think the element of being on a losing team has come into play here as well.

What do you guys think about the overall situation?

The reality is and the way this ties into Ravens is, the way Rices deal is structured, we could be in the exact same situation 2-3 years from now. Obviously i dont think Steve B would ever say and treat a star player the way that the Jags owner has. Hes new to the league and doesnt really understand how things work yet. Winning does make problems go away, but youre right that theyre just fighting for worth. They feel undervalued just like we do at our jobs. Ive asked for raises before, i cant see why players cant.

**Kyle Cactus** · 08-23-2012, 08:01 AM

Jones-Drew is well within his right to hold out. The team is well within their rights to not budge, though Kahn was foolish to stoke the fire with his comments.

In the end I think it's loose-loose for Jones-Drew. He may think he has leverage because he's so valuable to this team, but even with him on the field it's still a losing team. If he was the difference between a playoff team and an average team there would be leverage. Being the difference between a bad team and a somewhat worse team isn't enough leverage to get a new contract. If the Jags are smart they will get the owner to stop flapping his gums, while they continue to stand firm with the current contract.

**Raveninwoodlawn** · 08-23-2012, 08:04 AM

If I were Jax, I'd trade him.

I get the whole idea of how it's not fair that teams can cut guys for underperforming contracts and players are stuck when they outperform it.

But on the whole...my belief is that I agree with the young guys who are are stars, yet are still in their rookie deals...not so much vet stars who are pissed 2-3 years into record contracts.

If a player wants to constantly be at the top pay for his position, he needs to sacrifice some in terms of the length of these deals they sign. If you are elite, and stay elite after signing a 5 year deal, your contract is guaranteed to be passed by quite a bit 3-4 years into it.

Back to the question though, I would not give him a new deal if he is expecting to break the bank again. The team is still going to be bad, with or without him...he doesn't make Jax into a contender or anything.

I'd get what I could for him in a trade...draft picks.

**Shas** · 08-23-2012, 08:04 AM

The PR stuff and messages to other team members is irrelevant to me. All teams go through bouts of unhappy players and eventually everything is worked out -- never exactly how one side or the other or both wants -- and we move on.

Besides, I don't think Khan has been disrespectful. I think MJD and his agent claim that, but to me it's a sign that they can't get any traction in their hold out and are clamoring to incite fans to pressure the team. That won't work.

It's a fallacy that MJD is underpaid. He got a $31 million, five-year deal three years ago. But the deal was front loaded. He's been sitting on 2012 and 2013 compensation for three years now, earning interest. Now he wants us to buy the fact that earning just shy of $5 million a year for the next two years makes him underpaid. Sorry, not buying it.

I'm thrilled the team is responding how it is responding.

Interesting to note, however, that Ray Rice just signed a front loaded deal. We'll see how that sits with him down the road.

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:07 AM

It is interesting to think about the reality that they are probably still a losing team with Jones Drew. The only solace they could take, would be that they wouldn't be far off from Indianapolis and Tennessee, and could even on par with them. That only leaves Houston.

It opens up the idea of whether or not Khan's comments were true? I think that we all agree that they should not have been said, but would Jones-Drew's absence have an even greater effect on ticket sales?

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by Shas

The PR stuff and messages to other team members is irrelevant to me. All teams go through bouts of unhappy players and eventually everything is worked out -- never exactly how one side or the other or both wants -- and we move on.

Besides, I don't think Khan has been disrespectful. I think MJD and his agent claim that, but to me it's a sign that they can't get any traction in their hold out and are clamoring to incite fans to pressure the team. That won't work.

It's a fallacy that MJD is underpaid. He got a $31 million, five-year deal three years ago. But the deal was front loaded. He's been sitting on 2012 and 2013 compensation for three years now, earning interest. Now he wants us to buy the fact that earning just shy of $5 million a year for the next two years makes him underpaid. Sorry, not buying it.

I'm thrilled the team is responding how it is responding.

Interesting to note, however, that Ray Rice just signed a front loaded deal. We'll see how that sits with him down the road.

'Our star players doesn't even push the meter?' You don't think that is disrespectful? Could you imagine Steve Bisciotti saying that about one of the Ravens' star players?

While it's true that he got a front loaded deal, he certainly played up to it, if not exceeding that deal and still is. That is the issue.

I agree with RaveninWoodlawn that I would, personally, be weary of a lengthy deal. However, what if he and his agent are simply looking for a raise to finish out the deal?

**Shas** · 08-23-2012, 08:15 AM

It seems to me that the value of running backs continues to decline as the supply of good backs grows and grows. I wonder what the Jags could even get for the guy? Would you really trade a first round pick for MJD knowing you'd then need to give him a big contract? When the Ravens traded for McGahee they gave up a third and seventh round pick. Then they gave him as seven year contract that was really five years. He got a $7 mil signing bonus and one big payday year -- $6 million in 2010. It was backloaded so he never really saw a lot of the potential money. The point is that even that was a lot to give up.

I think the Jags need to sit tight. They're already a mediocre team. Making MJD ultra-happy, and hoping the locker room perks up accordingly isn't going to really make much of a difference anyway.

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:18 AM

Originally Posted by Shas

It seems to me that the value of running backs continues to decline as the supply of good backs grows and grows. I wonder what the Jags could even get for the guy? Would you really trade a first round pick for MJD knowing you'd then need to give him a big contract? When the Ravens traded for McGahee they gave up a third and seventh round pick. Then they gave him as seven year contract that was really five years. He got a $7 mil signing bonus and one big payday year -- $6 million in 2010. It was backloaded so he never really saw a lot of the potential money. The point is that even that was a lot to give up.

I think the Jags need to sit tight. They're already a mediocre team. Making MJD ultra-happy, and hoping the locker room perks up accordingly isn't going to really make much of a difference anyway.

Del Rio is gone, Jones Drew isn't happy and the team is relatively young now. I think that this would effect their potential to grow, because ownership has shown a lack of understanding, of how to handle player negotiations. Why should any of their 'up-starts' expect different treatment?

**Shas** · 08-23-2012, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by The Excellector

'Our star players doesn't even push the meter?' You don't think that is disrespectful?

No, I don't. Not in the least.

Khan's statement that this situation "doesn't move the needle" was in response to a question about whether a hold out stresses the team. He responded, not at all. As he should.

The statement was in no way disrespectful to the player and his skills. Khan in the same interview praised his ability and said he'd like to have him back. But he is simply saying that a holdout isn't going to stress out the team. They'll move on with the players they have in camp.

The Ravens have said as much in these situations. Harbaugh more than once has made comments about how they'll be fine and play with the best players available.

**nickh0801** · 08-23-2012, 08:24 AM

Don't sign a contract if you're not going to honor it. MJD has 2 years left...shut up and play and when 2 years is up, ask for more $ then. I'm all for asking for more $ when you are renegotiating at the end of your contract, but when you still have multiple years left on a deal that you signed, shut up and honor it!!!

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:28 AM

Originally Posted by Shas

No, I don't. Not in the least.

Khan's statement that this situation "doesn't move the needle" was in response to a question about whether a hold out stresses the team. He responded, not at all. As he should.

The statement was in no way disrespectful to the player and his skills. Khan in the same interview praised his ability and said he'd like to have him back. But he is simply saying that a holdout isn't going to stress out the team. They'll move on with the players they have in camp.

The Ravens have said as much in these situations. Harbaugh more than once has made comments about how they'll be fine and play with the best players available.

He's your team leader though. Your team leader, not being there, certainly effects your team. 'Move the needle', is an interesting choice of words as well.

While Jones-Drew's presence might not turn them into a playoff team this year, his play on the field could help them develop a bridge, while they gather more talent and improve chemistry. Without that bridge, they could be a ten year losing team that nobody wants to play for.

**Shas** · 08-23-2012, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by nickh0801

Don't sign a contract if you're not going to honor it. MJD has 2 years left...shut up and play and when 2 years is up, ask for more $ then. I'm all for asking for more $ when you are renegotiating at the end of your contract, but when you still have multiple years left on a deal that you signed, shut up and honor it!!!

If you want to talk about disrespectful, let's talk about Jones and agent creating this issue in the first place and threatening to blow up the locker room chemistry -- if indeed we all are going to buy off on the idea that public contract disputes damage the psyches of the younger players. If that's the effect, then MJD is the cause, not Khan.

If there is any disrespect, it's the player disrespecting the team that already committed $31 million to him.

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by nickh0801

Don't sign a contract if you're not going to honor it. MJD has 2 years left...shut up and play and when 2 years is up, ask for more $ then. I'm all for asking for more $ when you are renegotiating at the end of your contract, but when you still have multiple years left on a deal that you signed, shut up and honor it!!!

Then the same should go for the front office. So, no players should be getting cut. If they overplay their contract and should still honor it, a front office should also honor that contract when they are considering getting rid of an aging player or a player on the decline.

**The Excellector** · 08-23-2012, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by Shas

If you want to talk about disrespectful, let's talk about Jones and agent creating this issue in the first place and threatening to blow up the locker room chemistry -- if indeed we all are going to buy off on the idea that public contract disputes damage the psyches of the younger players. If that's the effect, then MJD is the cause, not Khan.

When did they threaten to blow up the locker room chemistry?

**LukeDaniel** · 08-23-2012, 08:50 AM

Originally Posted by Shas

The PR stuff and messages to other team members is irrelevant to me. All teams go through bouts of unhappy players and eventually everything is worked out -- never exactly how one side or the other or both wants -- and we move on.

Besides, I don't think Khan has been disrespectful. I think MJD and his agent claim that, but to me it's a sign that they can't get any traction in their hold out and are clamoring to incite fans to pressure the team. That won't work.

It's a fallacy that MJD is underpaid. He got a $31 million, five-year deal three years ago. But the deal was front loaded. He's been sitting on 2012 and 2013 compensation for three years now, earning interest. Now he wants us to buy the fact that earning just shy of $5 million a year for the next two years makes him underpaid. Sorry, not buying it.

I'm thrilled the team is responding how it is responding.

Interesting to note, however, that Ray Rice just signed a front loaded deal. We'll see how that sits with him down the road.

This sums it up perfectly.

**GOTA** · 08-23-2012, 08:53 AM

Kahn has also given up 4 home games to set up shop in London. He seems a lot more business oriented than the usual NFL owner who puts winning first, even if they aren't good at accomplishing it. I have a feeling that Kahn is going to own this team for 10 years and then try and flip it after he moves them to a better market. This is the same guy who wanted to buy the Rams but as soon as he couldn't jumped at the next available team. This is an investment which means he's not going to put extra money into it now because winning now doesn't mean anything to his long term plans.

**Kyle Cactus** · 08-23-2012, 08:54 AM

I don't think the issue is weather or not Kahn disrespected MJD. The issues is weather or not Kahn said something that could be interpreted by a player as disrespect.

Kahn has every right to disrespect anyone he wants, it just doesn't make good business sense to risk offending a star player. Stick to your guns and don't talk about it publicly. That's what smart owners and smart GMs do.

**Stealthbirds80** · 08-23-2012, 08:57 AM

I look at this in this way as the NFL is an industry and every team is a company.

The owner has the money to pay MJD, but feels that he needs to place his stamp on the team.

MJD is trying to get paid with the industry standard for his performance, but is aging.

The mistakes thus far appear to be on the owner's side with the talking in public about this matter instead of handling this in house.

MJD is looking for that last payday. By all accounts he has earned this considering his environment that in which he still has produced against all odds really.

I really don't see a solution except for letting him walk via trade. Even that I don't see happening as teams may not be willing to take on this contract right now at MJD's age.

The owner is not in the wrong really except talking much on the contract. Leave that to the front office.