1st Presidential Debate....what did you think?

[CptJesus]

Linking to politifact while criticizing linking to the GOP, kinda a 6 of 1 half dozen of the other...

Also, how can a job be created when it's just filling a position that was lost during the recession. That's not creating, it's recouping...

I'm not sure if you noticed, but politifact called out Obama on plenty too. Also, if it was a job that didn't exist before, that's called creation. If jobs shifted from one sector to another, jobs were lost in one sector, and created in the other.

[AirFlacco]

I actually liked some of politifacts statements. They were fair but also gave some
opinions instead of facts like the last one posted in the link where they said Romneys
statement that the board will dictate health care that individual Americans will get
aka DEATH PANELS. That was an opinion and so were some others. Even some staunch liberals are against these panels and want to repeal it, officially called the Independent Payment Advisory Board or IPAB.

Like one DEM said on TV, OBAMA CARE has some things wrong and so did the Civil
Rights Bill. LBJ said just pass it and go back and fix it.

Dig this:

_____________________________________
During Wednesday evening’s presidential debate, President Barack Obama repeated his support for the controversial Medicare Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) — often dubbed by conservatives as Obamacare’s “death panels” — in a back-and-forth with GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney.
________________________________

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/10/03/ob...#ixzz28Lway3Yg



http://dailycaller.com/2012/10/03/ob...rt-for-repeal/

[Sirdowski]

I could point out that Mitt did a complete 180 on so many issues during this debate, and that he straight up lied about plenty, but I know you, like the majority of the American public, don't really care about things like fact checking.

In that light, I'll definitely give the debate to Romney. Style over substance. Obama just sat there and took it. So did the moderator in fact.

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Ahh yes, insults, that's what this otherwise intelligent discussion was missing.

[NCRAVEN]

I'm not sure if you noticed, but politifact called out Obama on plenty too. Also, if it was a job that didn't exist before, that's called creation. If jobs shifted from one sector to another, jobs were lost in one sector, and created in the other.

Seriously?

If lets say (for example) in 2008 100,000,000 people have jobs in 2009 99,500,000 people have jobs and in 2012 99,950,000 people have jobs - nothing has been created, we still have not recouped all the jobs that were lost.

I'm not trying to be condescending here, you have got to be smart enough to see that is not creating anything.

[darb72]

Seriously?

If lets say (for example) in 2008 100,000,000 people have jobs in 2009 99,500,000 people have jobs and in 2012 99,950,000 people have jobs - nothing has been created, we still have not recouped all the jobs that were lost.

I'm not trying to be condescending here, you have got to be smart enough to see that is not creating anything.

It's Galin, so no, he's probably not.

I didn't get to watch the debate but I've read a lot about it and it's clear Mitt won. I read the fact checks and while both made a few errors, it's pretty clear Obama made the bigger missteps.

[CptJesus]

Seriously?

If lets say (for example) in 2008 100,000,000 people have jobs in 2009 99,500,000 people have jobs and in 2012 99,950,000 people have jobs - nothing has been created, we still have not recouped all the jobs that were lost.

I'm not trying to be condescending here, you have got to be smart enough to see that is not creating anything.

You're not understanding the semantics of the phrasing. Let me put in in another way.

If you were to manufacture 500 tractors, and at the same time 500 tractors were destroyed, you have both created 500 tractors, and lost 500 tractors.

So when Obama says 5 million jobs have been created, that is still 100% accurate. You are looking at net gains, which is completely different from actual creation.

Also, I am not Galin. If you look back, we were posting simultaneously at one point.

As far as insults, there was a thread not too long ago where the members of this board basically decided that fact check sites are completely biased and not to be trusted (unless of course they're conservative slanted). I'm just restating the opinion of the people here.

[NCRAVEN]

You're not understanding the semantics of the phrasing. Let me put in in another way.

If you were to manufacture 500 tractors, and at the same time 500 tractors were destroyed, you have both created 500 tractors, and lost 500 tractors.

So when Obama says 5 million jobs have been created, that is still 100% accurate. You are looking at net gains, which is completely different from actual creation.

This is just nonsense. Let's run with your analogy for a second.

If you had 500 tractors bought by farmers and a tornado wiped them all out and the farmers came back to by 500 tractors, you didn't have any new people buy tractors you just replaced them.

That's not growing, you need to sell NEW tractors.

[CptJesus]

Who said anything about growth? You're missing the fundamental point here. In the exact example you gave me, the 500 tractors that they bought the second time are still new tractors. They were still created, even though the original 500 were destroyed. The new jobs aren't magically old just because we lost other ones. If you can't understand that point, there's no point in arguing. Creation and net gain are two different things. I even pointed out that we lost the same number as we gained. But that still doesn't change the fact that we created jobs.

What Obama said is completely true, if misleading.

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[NCRAVEN]

This is crazy. Really, you're example is nonsense because hiring someone is not the same as building a tractor, if someone's tractor blows up, they didn't come back and get a new one because they wanted to, they were just replacing. what. was. lost.

Let's use a more realistic example. I worked at a company in 2009 that employed 1,200 people they laid off about 300, 3 years later they have 1,200 again. Nothing was created, they brought back what they already had.

For something to be created, it has to be something that was not there before.

[CptJesus]

Are these the exact same jobs that were lost? Did we literally just cut a job and then reinstate it? 5 million new jobs were created. 5 million old jobs were lost. I don't see why this is so hard to get.

Our net gain was 0. Our jobs lost was 5 million. Our jobs CREATED was 5 million.

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[NCRAVEN]

IT"S NOT NEW IF YOU DIDN'T GAIN ANY JOBS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CptJesus]

Clearly you just don't understand what created means. So yeah this is a pointless argument.

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[NCRAVEN]

Yup, it's me who doesn't understand created.

BTW- the company I worked for in 2009 hired people for the exact same positions they cut.

[AirFlacco]

The radio just said 68% believed Mitt is now the stronger leader of the two.

It also said 48% say Mitt is now likeable. That is one of the things that kept the
polls so close. People bought off that they didn't know Mitt and he didn't connect
to the middle class because he was rich but last night he turned it around as
likeable and the stronger leader.

Even OBYs own people are saying that except CNN's Wolf who said his own poll
was over-stated.

[StingerNLG]

Even CNN said the 5 million number was not accurate. 4.2 million was about it. So that was a lie on Obama's side.

And we are still above 8% unemployment so where are all the new jobs?

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[AirFlacco]

CNN is a liberal rag. At least they're saying
its not 5M but the 4.2M is still wrong. Its
more like 125,000. That's it.

See NCs posts. 0x0=0.

The Prez didn't make mistakes. He flat out lied like on
the jobs numbers and the panels or board in OBAMA CARE.

He has to lie. He has nothing to run on. He can't debate the
points. That's why he got so flustered and edgy even with
the veteran moderator/MC and all the
attacks on Mitt and Bain, to deflect what he has done which is
nothing.

The country finally caught on what we've been saying all summer.

[HoustonRaven]

This is why the Dems don't have a clue about the economy.

If I have $500 in the bank, spend $300 and then get my account back up to $500, I don't have new money nor did I gain $300. I'm simply back where I started.

Try that shit with a credit card company and you'll see how much of a joke it is. Yet, in the liberal world, adding something that's been lost is seen as a gain?

That's too damn funny and an example how desperate they are to spin this debate loss.

[jonboy79]

By that analogy, Obama could in one day tripel taxes, and then the next cut them in half, and a week later say he cut taxes.


To me, the funniest part was reading my facebook page that night, and seeing that the firmly set liberals were calling it an Obama victory... How in the WORLD can you watch that and think he won??? then again, how in the world can you have lived in the US the last four years and want four more?

[AirFlacco]

Wait til you hear the spin on the new jobs report that came out 8:30 this morning.

Unemployment dropped to 7.8% down from 8.1% so you know the libbies will be rejoicing and say we're in a recovery.

However, only 114,000 jobs were created last month and the report doesn't consider all the people that dropped out of the job hunt and it never counts the under-employed.

How can it drop when only 114,000 jobs were
created? It can't unless you go by the libbies
math like that 4.2M job increase CNN posted.

There's no way you can dot the Is and cross the Ts on this report, especially since it's a gov't
report and OBY runs the govt.

McCain said OBY was just off for some reason but will bounce back in the next debate. It might be too late. We should see some movement for Mitt by Sunday's polls and millions are pouring in from GOPs who thought the race was over and OBY was gonna win.

Dick Morris was on and still says Mitt will win and by a landslide but I guess he didn't see
the last real clear map where OBY only needed
1 more battle ground state to get 270 electoral votes but that might change too with all the indies and undecideds voting for Mitt.

[AirFlacco]

LOL - Speaking of that phony jobs report.

After saying the report didn't add up above and it was a gov't report run by OBY, I went to Rush's site and he said OBY would manipulate that report so it would drop before the election.

Man was he right. ILMAO.




http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/