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  1. #13

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff



    Quote Originally Posted by ravens1217 View Post
    If you want every top assistant coach fired after starting 5-2 and in first place by 1.5 games despite multiple key injuries, what would you be saying if the record was opposite (2-5) and they were in dead last place. Or would you have already jumped off the bridge at that point?
    Your entitled to your opinion. Key injuries and losses does apply to the D and I noted that Pees was handed a less than other Ravens coordinators. Of the guys on that list Pees is the one guy who can justifiably stand up and say ...hey look at what i am working with here.

    Cam, Moeller have a long a history of underachieving IMO that extends beyond this season. Many teams make moves when they feel like they are not getting most out of their talent. You think the Texans were not happy to have moved on to Wade Phillips? How about the Falcons, think they are not happy they moved on to Mike Nolan? Just cause your a winning team does not mean the men that coach those players should not be held accountable to getting the best performance from the group they are responsible for. Personally I do not think this group hits that mark .
    A linebacker's job is to knock out running backs, to knock out receivers, to chase the football,
    -Ray Lewis




  2. #14
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    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevlar View Post
    Only problem with Nolan, he'd probably be itching to get the HC job. I don't think Harbaugh has made enough of a name for himself to feel secure enough to bring in a big name like that. One that could easily supplant him.
    Don't take this the wrong way but I think your smoking crack. Harbaugh has more than made a name for himself. He doesn't get the media hype because he's not a media hound but if Harbaugh were fired today, he'd have his choice of jobs. He's a guy that consistently produces a winning record year after year. He's made the playoffs and been able to win on the road. The only thing keeping Harbaugh from being a star in the NFL is that elusive Superbowl ring, which if he continues to knock on the door, he will eventually get.




  3. #15

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    Maybe Harbaugh can take a lesson from Billick. Didn't he hire Jim Fassel, one of his best friends at the time, as offensive coordinator (2004?). Then fire him after two unproductive offensive seasons(?) You can be a supportive Head Coach for just so long, then you've got to be realistic about how your team is headed. When your own career may be in jeopardy (not saying Harbs is), then you've got to assess players and coaches under you with a more sensible eye, and not let anything personal get in the way of a prudent decision... Bc
    Well said and completely agree.
    A linebacker's job is to knock out running backs, to knock out receivers, to chase the football,
    -Ray Lewis




  4. #16

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by BcRaven View Post
    Maybe Harbaugh can take a lesson from Billick. Didn't he hire Jim Fassel, one of his best friends at the time, as offensive coordinator (2004?). Then fire him after two unproductive offensive seasons(?) You can be a supportive Head Coach for just so long, then you've got to be realistic about how your team is headed. When your own career may be in jeopardy (not saying Harbs is), then you've got to assess players and coaches under you with a more sensible eye, and not let anything personal get in the way of a prudent decision... Bc
    That move didn't really work out, did it? We had a very easy schedule down the stretch, the Steelers were awful that season so we coasted to a 13-3 record. But when it mattered most in the playoffs against the Colts and their cover 2, Billick's offense yet again laid an egg. What a shame b/c that defense was a close 2nd to our 2000 team.




  5. #17

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenous1 View Post
    Your entitled to your opinion. Key injuries and losses does apply to the D and I noted that Pees was handed a less than other Ravens coordinators. Of the guys on that list Pees is the one guy who can justifiably stand up and say ...hey look at what i am working with here.

    Cam, Moeller have a long a history of underachieving IMO that extends beyond this season. Many teams make moves when they feel like they are not getting most out of their talent. You think the Texans were not happy to have moved on to Wade Phillips? How about the Falcons, think they are not happy they moved on to Mike Nolan? Just cause your a winning team does not mean the men that coach those players should not be held accountable to getting the best performance from the group they are responsible for. Personally I do not think this group hits that mark .
    Whether you think our assistants are the best in the NFL or not, you can't just fire everybody, it's unrealistic. This collective group, management, players, coaches, etc. have won a playoff game in 4 straight years, which is rarely done in the NFL and something we as fans should be proud of. You praise Wade Phillips, who just last week gave up 6 TD passes to Aaron Rodgers and was absolutely torched. Mike Nolan is now with his 3rd team in 4 years, there's a reason he's finding a new home almost every season.

    Everybody from the top on down turned in a dud yesterday, but they're not going to hit the panic button just yet. Bye week came at a great time, and they have 2 weeks to figure it out. It's not just the coaches to blame, the players have to take some responsibility, its not as black and white as people make it out to be. Now if we lose say 4 or 5 in a row, then something major might happen, but I still think they wait until the year is over to make a decision on Cam.

    Like I keep saying, win your games at home and find a way to split on the road, and you are guaranteed a first round bye.




  6. #18

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    There is one reason to think this will finally be the last year of Cam - Flacco's contract. It's clear with the turbulance of their relationship that should Joe resign he will not want Cam back here. Then the Ravens will have a choice to make. Flacco may not be an elite QB but when the choice is between him and Cam there is no choice. Lol




  7. #19

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by ravens1217 View Post
    Whether you think our assistants are the best in the NFL or not, you can't just fire everybody, it's unrealistic. This collective group, management, players, coaches, etc. have won a playoff game in 4 straight years, which is rarely done in the NFL and something we as fans should be proud of. You praise Wade Phillips, who just last week gave up 6 TD passes to Aaron Rodgers and was absolutely torched. Mike Nolan is now with his 3rd team in 4 years, there's a reason he's finding a new home almost every season.

    Everybody from the top on down turned in a dud yesterday, but they're not going to hit the panic button just yet. Bye week came at a great time, and they have 2 weeks to figure it out. It's not just the coaches to blame, the players have to take some responsibility, its not as black and white as people make it out to be. Now if we lose say 4 or 5 in a row, then something major might happen, but I still think they wait until the year is over to make a decision on Cam.

    Like I keep saying, win your games at home and find a way to split on the road, and you are guaranteed a first round bye.
    Not suggesting that we fire anyone in season. That said, if the players performance is fair game to be discussed then so is the coaching staff. If you cant see that Wade Philips and Mike Nolan have had positive influences on the teams they are with then your just looking at it with blinders.

    Again Pees is the one guy who can make some legit argument that he has been hampered from putting out a good unit by injury and FA losses. Cam...whats his excuse? There is plenty of talent on the Offensive side of the ball. Plenty has been invested there and its not unreasonable to expect a certain level of return on that investment. If you think the uneven offensive play to this point is enough, we just have to agree to disagree
    A linebacker's job is to knock out running backs, to knock out receivers, to chase the football,
    -Ray Lewis




  8. #20

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Cj34 View Post
    There is one reason to think this will finally be the last year of Cam - Flacco's contract. It's clear with the turbulance of their relationship that should Joe resign he will not want Cam back here. Then the Ravens will have a choice to make. Flacco may not be an elite QB but when the choice is between him and Cam there is no choice. Lol
    That is a very good point. If they are going to sign him to a contract that pays him over 50 million guaranteed, he is going to have some say in the matter of who is calling the offense.




  9. #21

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    Quote Originally Posted by Cj34 View Post
    There is one reason to think this will finally be the last year of Cam - Flacco's contract. It's clear with the turbulance of their relationship that should Joe resign he will not want Cam back here. Then the Ravens will have a choice to make. Flacco may not be an elite QB but when the choice is between him and Cam there is no choice. Lol
    This. Midway through the season and we still see some of the same issues on the offensive side of the ball. Me beginning to think that it might be chemistry related underneath the surface. Unless Cam and this offense finishes strong he's out after this season.




  10. #22
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    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    I don't think so. Harbaugh is not going to fire him. I just don't see that happening.




  11. #23
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    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    What's Moeller's connection to this cabal? I've been snooping around the intertoobz & I haven't found any direct link to Harbaugh prior to coming here. Is he Cam's fair-haired boy?




  12. #24

    Re: Harbaugh loyal to a fault... Ravens coaching staff

    There are decisions that do make you question whether or not John Harbaugh has taken the right approach. However, there are a few that show you he is willing to make a change if he feels it is necessary.

    For example, the front office essentially suggested to Mattison that he take another offer if it comes around, because they were going to let him go. With that, John Harbaugh promotes Chuck Pagano and the defense flourishes.

    Then, you have a situation such as the one with Andy Moeller, where Matsko was a guy everyone seemed to respect and thought had the offensive line moving in the right direction (was dealing with injuries up front before he was gone). Moeller hasn't done much better with the offensive line, but has seemingly been given a longer period to work things out.

    As far as Cam Cameron is concerned, I think that John Harbaugh has unfairly shouldered the heat for Cameron being retained. Let's be clear: They all wanted Cam Cameron replaced. However, their dream replacement was retained by San Diego and we all know who that was. So, the front office chose continuity. Steve Bisciotti himself has talked about how they prefer to win games 15-12, rather than 45-42. This isn't merely a John Harbaugh issue. It is a front office issue.

    Rest assured, however, that they now have their fall-back option in Jim Caldwell. So, if Norv Turner somehow survives another year and no other suitable options show up, you'll see Caldwell.
    "When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"




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