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  1. #253

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread



    is that inflation adjusted? And by inflation adjusted I DO NOT mean using hte current governmental defined inflation figure, but one that is based on reality. If not, 2% isn't even keeping up with real world inflation.




  2. #254

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    I dont think theres any question the debt has gone up, however i think there are circumstances to why that happened out of his control. Sure he could have done a few things differently here and there but a lot of that is party lines which most Conservatives wont agree with whether it worked or not. always at least two ways to do anything, imo.
    One problem with this. Democrats held both the House and Senate for Obama's first two years. The media was able to fool half the country that Conservatives have been holding him up since the day he got into office, when he had a supermajority in the Senate and overwhelming control of the House.

    The reason the House flipped in 2010 is because people wanted to stop what was going on. It's also why they kept the house now. A buffer to hopefully keep Obama from finishing off what he started.




  3. #255

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Also, HR man you were dead on about the whole damn thing. I thought the debates were enough when they swung the polls in Romney's direction. But you were absolutely right that Romney should have fought back long before the convention. He allowed the Democrats, Obama, and the lapdog media to define him through complete lies and demagoguery.

    The Republican party on the whole also never got behind him. Republican leadership in the House and Senate hardly uttered a word of support for Romney. Ohio Gov. Kasich should have been all over the media airwaves pushing Ohio for him. And during Hurricane Sandy while everyone was focused on Chris Christie getting used by Obama for nothing but a Presidental-looking photo op, the Republicans were silent.

    And then the polls. Rasmussen was so wrong on Party ID, and you were right about the state polls. The electorate was exactly what it was in 2008, and it looks like 2010 was just an anomaly.

    So, I'm man enough to admit I had this all wrong. In my heart, I thought high unemployment, high gas prices, debt and credit downgrades, and everything that happened in Libya and Syria would be enough to move the country back to the right. But the welfare state won. Obamaphones won. Vaginas over jobs won (and I know someone who actually told me they knew they would be financially worse off in 4 years and didn't care). The "give me free stuff" crowd won.




  4. #256
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    I take zero pride in being right but kudos to you for owning it. I could tell you we're invested in this more than some folks.

    Takes balls, my friend.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




  5. #257
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    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    I love the quote that conservatives can stop pretending they like Romney.

    Pic of a natural act: UBER RAVENS FAN AND HISTORIAN GURU. THE PAST IS NOT DEAD, IN FACT, IT IS NOT EVEN PAST.' WILLIAM FAULKNER.




  6. #258

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by StingerNLG View Post
    One problem with this. Democrats held both the House and Senate for Obama's first two years. The media was able to fool half the country that Conservatives have been holding him up since the day he got into office, when he had a supermajority in the Senate and overwhelming control of the House.

    The reason the House flipped in 2010 is because people wanted to stop what was going on. It's also why they kept the house now. A buffer to hopefully keep Obama from finishing off what he started.
    the effects were stopped and started turning around by that point. the reason they lost control wasnt so much that people wanted to stop what was going on, but young, minority and women voters didnt show up like they did for the presidential one.

    Ill go as far to say that it likely happens again and mid terms.
    Last edited by JAB1985; 11-08-2012 at 07:18 AM.
    -JAB




  7. #259

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    2% is not healthy, at all. 4+% is where it needs to be. 2 is barely keeping your head above water.
    The ideal growth rate is between 2-3%. This is fast enough to provide enough jobs but not so fast it will create inflation.
    you can put your own spin on it, but if youre going to quote a source you cant discredit it at the same time. bottom line is GDP is growing, all 3 sources say that.
    -JAB




  8. #260
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    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    you can put your own spin on it, but if youre going to quote a source you cant discredit it at the same time. bottom line is GDP is growing, all 3 sources say that.
    The source was to show the rate of "growth" since it linked to the reports. Read what Jonboy said after my post, it's spot on.
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  9. #261

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    The source was to show the rate of "growth" since it linked to the reports. Read what Jonboy said after my post, it's spot on.
    the point is its still growing. Not as fast as you may like but its not like its "stalled" or declining. 2-3% is good, we all would like more coming from a recession but its not a bad thing to have it in the "healthy" zone regardless. my statement that its continuing to grow is true, and if we continue to slow the spending and pay back the deficit, which Obama has said is going to be the focal point of this term, than i think well be alright.

    Its easy to point at whos in office and say the other would have done it better or faster, but in reality we have no idea. I think where we were, no matter who was the president wed be seeing similar numbers, or if they let the auto industry fail completely, possibly worse.

    Side note, the only company that still owes money is ford, who said it didnt need a bailout to begin with, odd.
    -JAB




  10. #262
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    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    the point is its still growing. Not as fast as you may like but its not like its "stalled" or declining. 2-3% is good, we all would like more coming from a recession but its not a bad thing to have it in the "healthy" zone regardless. my statement that its continuing to grow is true, and if we continue to slow the spending and pay back the deficit, which Obama has said is going to be the focal point of this term, than i think well be alright.
    That was the focal point of his first term too, wasn't it? Slow spending, not t o be a dick, but are you living in an alternate universe?

    And no 2 -3% is not real growth. That, like I said, is barely keeping your head above water.

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    Its easy to point at whos in office and say the other would have done it better or faster, but in reality we have no idea. I think where we were, no matter who was the president wed be seeing similar numbers, or if they let the auto industry fail completely, possibly worse
    Who was going to let the auto industry fail completely?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB1985 View Post
    Side note, the only company that still owes money is ford, who said it didnt need a bailout to begin with, odd.
    Again, not trying to be a dick, I'd suggest searching for your own news, to confirm what you're told.

    http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/11/news...uts/index.html
    Chrysler Group. GM received $51 billion in bailout funds and has paid Treasury about $24 billion, mostly with the proceeds of its November 2010 initial public offering. Treasury still holds about 500 million shares of GM, worth about $11.5 billion at current prices. But those shares would have had to rise to almost $57 a share from its current price of $23.14 in order for taxpayers to break even.

    The books are already closed on the Chrysler Group bailout. That automaker received $12.4 billion and repaid $11.1 billion, including interest on loans, leaving taxpayers about $1.3 billion short on that rescue.
    We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid. - Benjamin Franklin




  11. #263

    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NCRAVEN View Post
    That was the focal point of his first term too, wasn't it? Slow spending, not t o be a dick, but are you living in an alternate universe?
    Any time somebody says, "not to be a dick" its usually followed be a completely dick headed comment. The first term was getting us out of the recession by any means. Clearly doing what he had done wasnt conducive to paying off the debt if youre adding to it. again, i dont think a Republican would have done too much different considering where we were at.

    And no 2 -3% is not real growth. That, like I said, is barely keeping your head above water.
    its growth. which is all i said. above water is better than below the last i checked.

    Who was going to let the auto industry fail completely?
    depends on who you ask and what day of the week. some were for bankruptcy before government help, while the bailout was basically the same thing but before (basically just arguing for the sake of arguing over that one). Some did just want the free market system to run its course, whether that meant they survived or not.

    Again, not trying to be a dick, I'd suggest searching for your own news, to confirm what you're told.

    http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/11/news...uts/index.html
    i do research my own news, thanks. they repaid their loans as they are currently. the government still owns part of the companies, as they should per their investment. you dont make money by buying high and selling low. with the way the "original" companies were dissolved and in litigation its the only way for the government to make out on the deal. All depends on how you look at it, which is exactly why politifact considered it "half true" statement. to me, they paid back and the government has shares to sell to make back the rest. I dont look at a company I have stock in and say, the stock isnt payment for my investment. Thats pretty much exactly what it is. Youre saying because the company isnt selling for as much as they invested they still owe, i say it was a poor investment that needed to be done, and would have been regardless who was president.
    -JAB




  12. #264
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    Re: Election Day 2012 Thread

    Using your water analogy, I'd say is drowning by way of drips.

    There is a reason most businesses use 3% as the standard cost of living raise because that's the statistical average of growth in the US. 2% growth is still growth, yes, but when everything is increasing at a high rate, even if it's a modest 1%, it's still a slow burn towards the bad side of the economy.
    WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and/or supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. All statements and assertions contained herein may be subject to literary devices not limited to: irony, metaphor, allusion and dripping sarcasm.




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